it's time for a new independent movie industry

hey Directorik
it seems you are becoming the master of mis-quotes...could you please use the quote button and show me where in any of my posts that I said the plan was on my website? and that I asked any filmmaker to buy anything?..I know filmmakers don't have any money but they have enough brain power and talent as if to form into a collective could get anything accomplish and that is what I was seeking , I attempted to explain briefly what the plan was on this site under "Financing..Classified Ads" and the thread is called :Seeking A Finanicier of Horror" inwhich even there you express the same mis-quotes, this would not be a problem to me but it seems you expressed the same mis-quotes on another forum I posted to on the internet...so to be sure I went back and re-read all my posts and I still couldn't find where I said those things...so I await for you to point it out to me...er..you know a snitch in time will save from posting nine...you are displaying the first stages of "kill the messenger" syndrome
 
It does seem like others posting in this forum are twisting both our words. To make it perfectly clear I'll repeat that I have mentioned two ways we are looking for others to participate in our production. We are seeking an individual to come on as "co-executive producer" in addition to maybe holding an auction where you actually BUY something you want.

No one ever said anything about "giving your money away".
 
funches said:
hey Directorik
it seems you are becoming the master of mis-quotes...could you please use the quote button and show me where in any of my posts that I said the plan was on my website? and that I asked any filmmaker to buy anything?..I know filmmakers don't have any money but they have enough brain power and talent as if to form into a collective could get anything accomplish and that is what I was seeking , I attempted to explain briefly what the plan was on this site under "Financing..Classified Ads" and the thread is called :Seeking A Finanicier of Horror" inwhich even there you express the same mis-quotes, this would not be a problem to me but it seems you expressed the same mis-quotes on another forum I posted to on the internet...so to be sure I went back and re-read all my posts and I still couldn't find where I said those things...so I await for you to point it out to me...er..you know a snitch in time will save from posting nine...you are displaying the first stages of "kill the messenger" syndrome
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I was very interested in your plan. I asked for information and was directed to the website.

My intent was only to get more information to see if this is something my company would be willing to invest in. Without knowing details about this interesting idea I can't make an informed decision.

I apologize for misquoting you.
 
hey Directorik
you are doing it again, you say I have an interesting plan but that I have fail to give you the information that you need to make a decision...but when you first replied to my post you never introduced your company or anything about it, so then I went to your website and still nothing about your company, most production companies i run into ususally consist of two people and they have no money, you know more about me than I known about your company, with the kind of decisions I see you making on this forum I not assure if your company could handle a project like the one I have in mind..maybe you should send me the information that I would need to make that decision or least place it on your site like you keep suggesting to me
 
funches said:
hey Directorik
you are doing it again, you say I have an interesting plan but that I have fail to give you the information that you need to make a decision...but when you first replied to my post you never introduced your company or anything about it, so then I went to your website and still nothing about your company, most production companies i run into ususally consist of two people and they have no money, you know more about me than I known about your company, with the kind of decisions I see you making on this forum I not assure if your company could handle a project like the one I have in mind..maybe you should send me the information that I would need to make that decision or least place it on your site like you keep suggesting to me
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Fair enough, funches.

I'm sure you're correct - this isn't a project my company could handle. I apologize for wasting your time.

-rik
 
mrde50 said:
The Internet changed everything that we know about film/distribution. For once, the entire populace had one common electronic communication method. it was only a matter of time until film found its way there.

For us indies, without the Internet, none of us would even know the other exists. The top 7 hollywood studios would be our only link to film. For these large studios to boo-hoo the Internet as a valid method for distribution is silly. It's here to stay.

The best part of this is that us indies have the greatest exposure right now. It's Hollywood who's now trying to catch up.
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yes mrde50
the Internet makes this an even playing field, it is capable of linking everything together to create another venue for Independent movies, eventually the internet would move to the television screen and web pages replaced with video
 
Funches, I totally understand what your going through, and really appreciate poeple like you. Before I blow up, and get crazy up in here I just want to say that I respect all of you, and without most of you my stuff wouldn't even get out there. (And this does not apply to those who sent me movies.) Ok So two and half years ago I started this Tv Show VegasIndiesTV, I've been struggling so hard to get movies it's not even funny. O ya this show is about giving the indy crowd there exposre think of a film fest on TV. Ok so when I started this show, i charged 20 per submission, and this show was airing on UPN not some wack cable access you know where the simpsons play. After I did that I got sweated by many people, so I dropped the fee and made it free, yes I did get some films dont get me wrong but dam is it that hard to pay like 2 dollars and ship it to me. My point is it seems like everyone is all about themsleves and i know this because I don't know how many people I help with letting them borrow my 3500 dollar light kit, and then they still ask for more when I want something from them. But it's all good, because i love to help people. So I feel your pain when you try to start something everyone starts to jump down your throat, i just want to say that I support what your doing, and I really think you should think about Las Vegas not because I live here because we are finally getting a buzz out here. I just got finished with the 48 hour film project, and this was the first year. I'm really trying to network my ass out here, and so far I have some connections with Brenden the dude that owns the movie theaters, and the dude that co owns Cosco if any of you have a Cosco where you live you know what I'm saying. But as of right now i'm nobody , i've made a few shorts, I have a tv show. But with help and time things will get there. So drop me a line if you wanna chat about anything. And keep pushing who cares what people say. To the next Hollywood.
 
I hope you aren't referring to me, vegas. I seriously wanted info so I could decide if there was anything I could do to help.

And it seems no one here is jumping down funches throat. There appears to be genuine interest and some very thoughtful challenges. Nothing wrong with asking questions and challenging ideas.

Or so I thought.
 
Speaking of information, Rik... Did you get my email regarding the information I sent you about my film project?

Looking forward to your reply.

Jeff
 
knightowl said:
Speaking of information, Rik... Did you get my email regarding the information I sent you about my film project?

Looking forward to your reply.

Jeff
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Recieved and replied. Both of them.

Sorry it took me so long - I'm prepping for a September shoot.
 
Let's not fight, gents.

I have a question, Funches.
Is your plan only pertaining to Horror/Sci-fi, or will it include other genres as well?
Do you have equipment already, or are you looking for equipment?
What kind of shooting format? MiniDV or the elusive and sexy HD?
Do you have scripts? Do you NEED scripts?
Do you have investors?
When do you want to do this?
Where do you want to do this?
Is it a one-time event, or an on-going "club" of filmmakers?
What are the requirements for consideration of joining? Do you need to have a certain level of experience?
Will people be paid for services? Accomodations? Travel?
Is there travel involved or are filmmakers able to participate from thier native home?

Wow. More than one question. I think we need more information to mull about before any serious interests will arise.

Just trying to help. I think you have a good idea, it just needs to be worked out.
 
There is no fighting at all I just have an opinion, and sometimes the way you guys say things can bring someone down thats trying to do something good. Because It's happene to me before. Thats all no biggie. I'm just giving him the support. Good Luck.
 
Ah vegasindiestv
the horror stories of resistance I could tell you, but you are on the right path to one of the phases that’s needed to help create this venue. But because I may have to raise my own finances is why I must do phase one of the project in a way as to bring attention to it.

This explains why I have localized in Chicago as to have better control over it, the advertisement and finances that are raised can be better utilized by concentrating them into a given area to achieve maximum results, everyone and everything that is needed to produce the movie exist in Chicago, I simply have to find them, but I have been contacted by others in the USA and around the world that compose music, special effects etc.and like to participate in this project because they expressed that the plan is so weird and may draw so much attention that they see how It would benefit them..

The Ailanthus Chamber is a movie that is design to be produced in a way that Hollywood wouldn't do, as this may be a way to draw extra attention to it, it will be big production, low budget, no computer generated creatures, everything made and animated by hand and probably shot in a format that the average Joe could afford, maybe mini-dv, or some form of digital video so the look can be manipulated but no HD, but with the majority of the finances to be used for advertisement and placing it in Chicago’s theaters


the movie alone couldn't create by itself another venue. but other things, events and circus type atmosphere built around the movie mixed with a massive focus well timed advertisement campaign is designed to do that and possible if needed draw interested investors

Ten Chicago bands and ten Chicago nightclubs come into play as they are used to activate the chamber as one part of a massive pre-movie advertisement campaign designed to draw attention to the upcoming movie release

Ten unknown Chicago bands that having trouble selling CD and getting good gigs and looking for exposure and Ten Chicago nightclubs that looking for a way to bring in more business both of these forces combined could bring in some good financing

So the first step is to spread the legend of the Ailanthus Chamber throughout Chicago afterwards hold the concert with ten bands in ten nightclubs placed throughout the city and all simultaneously playing an unique resonant sound at the peak of evil (rush hour) that according to the legend will activate the chamber and with well placed advertisement will make this become a big event in Chicago, at this time it would have achieved maximum exposure, this is the time to announce the release of the movie into Chicago theaters

here some facts about the movie:.. in the movie the concert never took place because the Antishun wiped out most of the band members

Confused? Then read the post in “Financing Classified Ads” under the thread “Seeking a financier of horror” or just go to http://www.geocities.com/funchesfilms/index.html read the story and see the Antishun and become more confused .. this is only phase one of The Ailanthus Chamber Project, the internet plays a major part in linking everything up
 
I generally get the impression that if you have the time to post A4 spreads of blurb / rant / etc you're spending more time on this board and less time actually doing stuff and making stuff and making it work. I've been around too many people who are just full of 'Hot Air' as in... it's gonna be great... it's gonna be great... hype and then just get to the stage where they just fade away. They've had their 15 mins of fame and now they can't be bothered anymore. So don't blurb and blah about it until you've got some feasable way of doing it is my advice. Hype. Hmmm... I get the feeling that in the time it takes to get an Independent film market on the same level as hollywood film would probably have one of the lowest places in the entertainment market - Computer Games are getting scarily popular. But ho hum...
 
There have been quite a lot of good points raised in this thread.

Indie filmmakers often feel that the main separation that they have from the industry is in two key areas, funding and distribution. The usual complaint is that if we could just get adaquate access to funding and distribution we would be sucessful and along with that we complain that somehow the "industry" is keeping us from getting those two things.

One possible way of cracking the funding/distribution issue is to turn your back on the mainstream industry and find a direct link to audiences. The thinking behind this is that this will be easier than trying to make your money back from the existing industry. I've been working on a business model for this for the last year, and I think that on ultra low budget movies (below $15,000) it might be possible to self DVD's directly from a website profitably providing that the films have good marketing. My belief is that DVD sales would have to be supported by a global network of digital indie cinemas, which would have the sole job of promoting the film. (In real terms all this involves is a change in the sales agreement for the DVD, instead of restricting public showings the buyer would be given permission to project the filmor show it in public places, with no additional fees). This would mean that the filmmaker wouldn't attempt to earn from the indie cinemas, giving the indie cinema owner a chance to make a profit. The idea is that local cinema promotion would drive direct DVD sales. The only way to make something like this work is to have a enough feature lenght films available on DVD to fill an indie cinema's annual programme, assuming that they'd show a minimum of once a month. In real terms you need twelve feature films ready to go and twelve film makers committed to this process, plus 50 or 60 filmmakers worldwide prepared to run indie cinemas in their local communities. If I was intersted in making sub $15,000 films I'd do this (But I'm not)

The problem with these kind of schemes is that although they create the possiblitiy of an alternative market, they'll only support ultra low budget films. Vegas has a very valid point when he says that he's currently struggling to find enough films to provide free TV broadcast. I'm not convinced that there are enough sub $15,000 feature films worth watching and an indie cinema netwrok would have to have nothing but excellent films.

The truth is that for the indie feature film maker the real money isn't in self distribution, it's in international TV sales into existing TV markets. These kind of sales require an experienced sales agent, but represent a real opportunity for indie filmmakers to make a living from low budget productions, along side direct to DVD distribution handled via the industry.

The real issue for indie filmakers is neither funding or distribution. It's marketing. The other two follow on from that. If an indie filmaker can create enough public interest in their film they can get sales (either direct or via mainstream distribution). My personal opinion is that any feature film that starts it's life without a marketing strategy is almost doomed to gather dust at the end of production. (I speak from experience here) As indies we don't need a new industry we need more business skills and to get over the idea that we are somehow seperate from the industry. Whether we like it or not, we are the industry. We just haven't estqablished ourselves as a recognisable brand with teh film going/buying public.

One thing I do know is that as indies we have to be careful where we put our time and energy. Starting a new industry sounds like an appealing, easier option than learning how to suceed in the existing one, but actually it's not. The advantage that the existing industry has is that it already has links with a sufficiently large audience to make the maths work in our favor. What we need to do is to look at the business advantages we have over existing production companies. Personally I think it's in our experience of low/no budget production and our embracing of new production technology. If we focus on making great films and learning how those films can fill exisiting gaps in the industry we stand a great chance of sucess.

And one final point. The thing about film forums is that you never really know who you are speaking too and what their position in the industry really is. This is a small industry and one that lives and dies on personal relationships. It kind of makes sense here to treat everyone with respect, because one day you may be sitting across a desk from them pitching your project. :cool:
 
well Shot Renagade..I figure I would just waste time here posting in the hopes that maybe I could find enough people in Chicago that may be interested in this project to get it started and silly me thought that posting on this forum was the way to do it but I guess if I just sit in the house and wish hard enough little elves will bring them
 
Excellent post, clive.

I’m working with several companies that are financing and distributing small movies ($10,000 to $80,000). The two biggest problems are exactly what you mention:

1- Good, watchable product
2- Marketing

The money is there, the outlets are there, the audience is there. The good product isn’t and marketing isn’t.

The advent of cheap, high quality production and editing equipment hasn’t made the final product better. In fact the product has gotten worse. Now a movie maker can finish a feature length movie for well under $2,000.

I just finished a really “hard sell” movie - noir thriller with no names and no “hook” - and suddenly I have distributors calling me. I’ve never been in this position before. It’s because I have a watchable product.

Hell, I’ve been making crappy DTV horror movies for 20 years. No one gives a damn about the final product, but it sells and I make some money.

Direct marketing is a new, interesting way of getting movies out there. But it comes down to one main issue: marketing.
 
yes vegasindiestv, you have the right idea, now what if there were 50 or more shows like yours linked to a central website, there is an audience for Independent movies that know and don't expect these movies to be the quality of hollywood but know that they are capable of being just as entertaining, I played a 30 minute program called Stange Video on a cable station and sold 32 videos of that program, what if that same video played on 50 of these channels or 100 of these channels around the country all linked to a website..there are always things that can be done, the only stepping stone is finding people to do it, which is possible
 
Yes I agree with you guys, and Clive you nailed it right. We are the industry, basically we just have to make better shit come up with better stories and we are in. But it's all about the marketing get your name out there look at Sonnyboo, you guys know who I'm talking about. He's the master of marketing. So lets make some films.....
 
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