How much to do these two scenes?

A

Aspiring Mogul

Same question again, but with some specifics.

I've been perusing my previous threads, learning and re-learning what has been said, and, as I've said, I'm getting the urge to start filming. Believe it or not, I have done some scripts.

How much to do this one? I'm talking of two actors talking for about five minutes. That would be, say, $10 an hour for each actor, so $20, and then a movie crew of, say, how many? The other question is to get a look of pure white, as in the actors being in heaven.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNwzawXu4v8


I'm also, to cut a long story (literally) short, interested in filming an eating scene, which came out of our discussion in this thread. In particular, I'd like to do, say, a scene like this one in Apocalypse Now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5Vzc99itxE

There would be four people eating, so, say 4 x$10 or $40, the catered food, say, $50. But I don't know the cost of renting the film crew, because I don't know how many would be needed.

If someone can provide those estimates, I can get an idea. I would presume each scene was a few hundred dollars.
 
One more expense item: I would need someone to start a Youtube channel and upload the two videos. I would think the cost would be on IT person, but I really don't know. Thanks once again.
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
One more expense item: I would need someone to start a Youtube channel and upload the two videos. I would think the cost would be on IT person, but I really don't know. Thanks once again.
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You're calculating an IT guy to start you a Youtube channel as an expense? You're going to bleed money if that is the case. Start your own Youtube, you don't need a tech guy to open up a free Google account and click upload twice.
 
Beatlesfan1225 said:
You're calculating an IT guy to start you a Youtube channel as an expense? You're going to bleed money if that is the case. Start your own Youtube, you don't need a tech guy to open up a free Google account and click upload twice.
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If that's the case, the cost would be half an hour of his time, which is half of $75 or $37.50. That's not too bad, is it?
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
If that's the case, the cost would be half an hour of his time, which is half of $75 or $37.50. That's not too bad, is it?
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If you're spending $37.50 to have someone open you a free Google account - It is really very awfully bad, yes. That's like paying someone to Google something for you. It's incredibly easy to do yourself, and any money you're throwing at it whatsoever could be used on pretty much anything else of actual value.
 
If you managed to sign up to this website, then for gods sake do not pay someone to set up a youtube account. Unless you plan on paying them to manage all social media (and they're doing something you can't), it's madness. It'd also not be an IT person you were looking for.
 
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cheeseandachallenge said:
If you managed to sign up to this website, then for gods sake do not pay someone to set up a youtube account. Unless you plan on paying them to manage all social media (and they're doing something you can't), it's madness.
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^^

It would be one thing to have him manage the entirety of your digital presence - if you were doing extensive SEO or targeting demographics on social media sites. This is not that case, it is indeed madness.

As an independent film maker, you first have to devise the best ways to save money, because we're all darn near broke. $37 could go to many more useful things than opening a Google account with an overpaid IT guy!
 
But moving on from the Youtube blunder...

You've asked a question, that again, is very broad - As you've been told here, there is not a set cost for filming something. You could film either of those scenes for $100, or $100,000. What kind of equipment do you want to utilize? How will your crew be paid? How will you find your crew? You cited you want to 'rent a movie crew.' It usually doesn't work like that - you hire your crew, and then rent the equipment. There isn't a preset 'Movie Crew' option on the rental website that has them show up in a van at your door.

The pure white look of Heaven is going to involve a lighting setup and a set - further expenses that could range from renting a sound stage to filming in your garage. You could film it with a one man crew, two or three people, or twenty. Again, there isn't a set number saying you need X amount of people to perform X task. If you wanted to one man band it, there is no reason you couldn't lav them or put a boom on a stand and operate the camera yourself. Or you could hire a boom operator, sound guy, cameraman, etc. You get where I am going with this...

You'll have to get much, much more specific with your actual budget and available resources to narrow down any sort of number - We can't present you with one, nor can we even begin to lay down the estimates you've asked for. These are estimates you need to figure out based on what your resources are, and then come to us with the questions that follow that. You'll also want to get more realistic with your money - because again, going back to the Youtube thing, that's like throwing away money just to say you hired a professional. Be careful of that. We all want to say we had a big crew and big help to make us look, well, big. In reality, in today's world, we can do a lot by ourselves and minimize expenses if we think creatively - or rather, don't consider a free Google account an expense.
 
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Beatlesfan1225 said:
You've asked a question, that again, is very broad - As you've been told here, there is not a set cost for filming something. You could film either of those scenes for $100, or $100,000. What kind of equipment do you want to utilize? How will your crew be paid? How will you find your crew? You cited you want to 'rent a movie crew.' It usually doesn't work like that - you hire your crew, and then rent the equipment. There isn't a preset 'Movie Crew' option on the rental website that has them show up in a van at your door.
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I have no idea. But thanks for telling me what to do with the Youtube channel. :)
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
I have no idea. But thanks for telling me what to do with the Youtube channel. :)
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Those are things you're going to want to figure out - Lay out your resources and figure out what is manageable for you. Everything from the location, to the caliber of equipment, etc. In film, there isn't a default dollar tag for a conversation scene - each and every case is different depending on the quality of the shoot, and whether or not it needs a specific set, camera, or what have you.

Personally, I can't imagine filming a scene like the second one you mentioned for very much at all, it seems filming something like that should be a low budget learning experiment, unless you want to incorporate it into a larger project.

In all honesty, you seem wrapped up in unrealistic big picture semantics - I'd just go purchase a camera and learn for yourself how to film stuff like a conversation scene. The basics of film making don't have to be expensive; if you're just learning how to go out and film, I wouldn't be dropping hundreds of dollars on conversation scenes that you could hammer out with some local college students looking to expand a portfolio and a semi-decent modern, HD camera and mic.
 
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The scenes are part of a larger story, yes.

But your idea is good. What about the white background, though? I'd have thought it would involve a green screen.
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
The scenes are part of a larger story, yes.

But your idea is good. What about the white background, though? I'd have thought it would involve a green screen.
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Alright - Well, then I'd take a bit more care into them, if they are going to be used for a larger project.

In response to your white background question, (I hope we aren't departing from previous points, which are FAR more important than this) I wouldn't use a green screen - because then you'd just be keying one color to be another. I'd use a white screen, with good lighting and a camera that has adjustable lightness and white balance settings. You can find tutorials like this one below to figure that out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQMqajOg6G4
 
Given you don't have a youtube channel, I can assume you've not shot a film before? Get out there and shoot a bunch of stuff spending little money (or work on other people's productions) so then you have an idea of what is actually needed.

The second video is unavailable in my country, but you could shoot the first on a huge range of budgets.
The cheap way:
-Simple 3 point lighting set up - check rental prices in your area
-White set (I've never tried, but you could maybe get away with a room with white walls, or using white sheets since the shots are pretty over exposed). [EDIT: Beatlesfan posted a tutorial above]
-Direct, operate the camera, cater and edit yourself.
-1 PSM doubling as boom op (or have the actors in lavs) - they'll likely have their own gear, otherwise look into the cost of hiring the gear needed
-2x actors
-Costuming - Dunno what your scene is, but if it's set on earth today, you can have actors wear their own clothes, you can borrow some, or you can go to an op shop. If it's particularly special, you can probably hire something decent enough from a costuming shop

You could probably have set the set up before everyone arrived, got all your lighting sorted, etc. So you'd only need them for a few hours at most. 3 people at $10 an hour (if you insist on paying them - if you are for such a simple/short scene, it better be an amazing script) - $30 an hour X x amount of hours. Add on whatever your gear rental costs. You should be able to find all the things you need for a set in your own home, or a friends home. If you're paying them and it's a two hour shoot, I don't know if you need to feed them properly? Spend $20 on snacks and some coffee.

I'm assuming you own a camera and some editing equipment? If not you need to figure out what cameara + lenses are suitable and hire. There doesn't seem to be anything special happening in the edit - use freeware.

So that shouldn't cost more than $200 (a bit more if you need a camera). For something so low key, I'd probably just pay in food to cut costs.

But you could also be paying for:
A DoP (who likely has his own camera and maybe lights)
A lighting gaffer
A 1st AD
A producer
A writer to clean up the script
Set builders + a purpose built set
A proper sound team with proper sound gear (minimum 2-3 people)
Caterer
Production Assistants
Composer
Dialogue Editor
Foley artist (basically a whole audio post team)
Editor
etc etc

I would do it the first way (or maybe somewhere in between - but pretty close to the first way). But that's what works for me, because I know I'm capable of wearing those many hats for such a simple scene, and the increase in quality I would get by spending more/hiring more people wouldn't be justifiable for me right now.

You need to get some idea of what you're capable of, how you work, and what areas you actually need to hire people in. It's hard to know that without experience. Get experience without spending money. Don't do what this guy did http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=54472
 
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Cheese hit the nail on the head. He gave you what you could spend your money on, (Which again, is a radical difference depending on your need - Are you shooting on a T3i or a RED camera? Or a Flip?) but again, suggested you go out and get some experience first.

I think this is the key thing to take away from this thread - before you go spending hundreds of dollars on crews and rentals, go get a camera, some friends, and learn the process. Figure out how to wear all the hats yourself, instead of instantly going to paying people to wear them for you - You'll never be adequate in film if you can't do it all from the ground up with as little as possible - the best boss can do every job.

Go learn on the cheap - see if film making is really for you before you drop a couple hundred dollars to film a conversation on a more professional level. You can't go 0 to 60 in film, it just doesn't work like that.

Oh, and the link Cheese linked out is an amazing thread to relay back to - That guy just threw money at it in the hopes it would return with something feasible and didn't learn anything in the process.
 
The super low-budget way to do this is to hire actors who will work for free. Many will for experience and food on set (while some would advise against it, the pizza route is the cheapest option or a sub platter, and then have a table with bottled water and snacks set up during the shoot).

The white background could be something like this http://www.amazon.com/CowboyStudio-Photography-Backdrop-Crossbar-Background/dp/B002SGKATA/ or in some instances a white bedsheet. You can buy cheap studio lights on amazon or, for super low-budget purposes, go buy work lights at a place like Home Depot for $30 or $40.
 
Beatlesfan1225 said:
I think this is the key thing to take away from this thread - before you go spending hundreds of dollars on crews and rentals, go get a camera, some friends, and learn the process. Figure out how to wear all the hats yourself, instead of instantly going to paying people to wear them for you - You'll never be adequate in film if you can't do it all from the ground up with as little as possible - the best boss can do every job.
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I'm not sure I should do that. I'm at the stage of my career where I should be learning to delegate, because it's not cost-effective to learn new technical skills. The proper goal now is to learn how to delegate and manage a budget, not learn how to use a camera or, for that matter, what type of camera to use.
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
I'm not sure I should do that. I'm at the stage of my career where I should be learning to delegate, because it's not cost-effective to learn new technical skills. The proper goal now is to learn how to delegate and manage a budget, not learn how to use a camera or, for that matter, what type of camera to use.
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Delegate all you want - It's going to end in a pile of burning flames if you yourself can't be a sufficient, savvy, thoughtful, and creative filmmaker on your own. You can't just outsource your creativity and throw money at it at hope something sticks. You saying that you don't want to learn what camera to use, or any technical skills for that matter, would probably frustrate the majority of this forum - it's an incredibly ignorant way to go about entering filmmaking. The best boss can wear all of the hats - that way he can properly delegate them. How on earth do you plan on doing so, when you can't even figure out what camera you want to shoot on or how to get a crew? My goodness, some rental agency is going to eat you up like a suburban mom at an auto dealership - It's great to take advantage of the person who has absolutely no idea what they're doing, but loves to believe they do. I'd be borderline insulted by a director of a shoot if he couldn't even do any of the jobs he was trying to 'delegate' - That's like having a college lecture taught by an elementary school teacher. (I have plenty of similies...)

I take my leave on this thread, because it doesn't seem like you actually want the input we're giving you - you've been given a lot of valuable advice you don't want to address; most of which was already advised in your 'How Much to Make Martial Arts?' thread. - You're set on crashing and burning in a pile of flaming money.

Good luck with your filmmaking.
 
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I have to have some knowledge, but the cameraman should decide, based on my budget and requirements. As for the delegation, if you have no money to begin with, then it's not worth it.

I've decided I should be a producer, which means I should get another one to hold my hand - that's probably the best approach.
 
Aspiring Mogul said:
I've decided I should be a producer, which means I should get another one to hold my hand
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I've decided to be a NASCAR driver - but I don't know how to drive the car, and I don't plan on learning. I'll just sit in the passenger seat and rely on the crew and hired driver to do it for me. I wouldn't know if they're doing a good or terrible job, or whether or not I'm getting my money's worth, how would I? I can't drive this thing. But hey, I look good in this shiny race car. Who cares whether or not I know how to race? I've got people to know things for me!


Had to put that in perspective. NOW, I take my leave. - Beatlesfan out
 
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