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Question about getting sound.

H

harmonica44

I was looking to people who have made films in where I live, to get advice on how to get good sound. One thing some people have said on here, is that when shooting outdoors, use a shotgun mic, and use a cardioid for indoors. However one guy I talk to who has made a movie, shot every indoor seen with a Sennheiser MK 416, he rented each time. He hired a sound guy to do it, but has no idea how he was able to get a shotgun mic to sound so good for indoors. If it can be done, that would save me buying another mic, but how do you get achieve that cardioid sound, with a shotgun? I will get a sound guy as well, but I wanna know how it works since it's my project of course. Thanks.
 
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Shotguns, especially moderate length shotguns like the 416 can be used with good results indoors provided the space is not overly reflective, actor movement is limited, and proper attention is paid to the specifics of booming indoors. Swinging the mic in the space during blocking rehearsals will quickly determine whether it's the appropriate mic for the situation.
 
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I would listen for myself and judge what mic is best for you - go to a store and test them out both indoors and out and buy the one which you like best. It's your ears and your movie :)
 
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"You have a limited budget - do not buy gear. Hire people with gear."

As a general principal I agree. I did recently go ahead and buy my own camera rig (my DP doesn't own one), but ESPECIALLY for sound I hire a skilled person with their own gear.
 
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I too bought a camera for a DP that didn't have one but I wanna know what's what, in case the sound guy I hire does not have it. Plus when we shop around the guys who have gear cost a lot more to hire then a lot who don't. I am more comfortable buying my own as some sound guys have cheaper gear which I was advised against. But I will keep looking.

It looks like it might be cheaper to hire a sound guy that works for less and does not have equipment, and just buying the equipment myself.
 
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ROC said:
I would listen for myself and judge what mic is best for you - go to a store and test them out both indoors and out and buy the one which you like best. It's your ears and your movie :)
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I can't, because the stores where I live the mics have to be ordered in and they don't have them on stock to test. So I need to know what's good before I order unfortunately. I would like to shoot the whole thing with one mic though cause of budget.
 
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I'm a HUGE proponent of owning your own equipment. At low budgets, you're either asking people to alter their schedules for your project (often for free), or scheduling time that works within their schedules (which will typically change on a moment's notice). Owning your own equipment allows more flexibility when scheduling.

I understand the arguments with renting, but everytime we've tried to arrange that, it's gotten messed up somehow... either the rental house rented the gear out to someone else or their hours didn't fit with any of ours for gear pickup... we ended up having to "Phone a friend", then play the producer game wherein I convinced the rental house to trust my friend without the normal due-diligence they go through when signing up renters.

Where I live, our rental house options are limited to 3 places, each more than an hour from my house. I own my equipment so I can shoot when and where I want with equipment that I know REALLY well as it's the stuff I've used on every shoot.
 
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Harmonica, I don't want to be too forward here, but I've read most of your posts on this forum and I think people would be in a better place to help you out if you maybe answered some fundamental questions:

1) How old are you? Not entirely relevant, but it might help gauge your experience.
2) How much experience do you have in making films? List as much as you can remember, whether it be shooting a short with friends or working as a random crew member on a larger film.
3) Do you have any formal education in film-making (like a course or a college degree)?
4) Have you read any books on film-making? What specifically? (e.g. sound design or camera work or anything else?)
5) Is your 75k budget strictly for the feature film you've written, or is it for buying equipment as well (sound gear, cameras, etc)?
6) Who do you have on your crew? Do you have an experienced DP, and if so, how experienced is he? Any other members? Any friends willing to help out, etc?
7) What kit do you currently have? I know you have a camera, do you have anything else, like a tripod, a field recorder, lights...?

This information would give people an idea of what would be the next logical step to helping you make your film.
 
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SiCurious said:
Harmonica, I don't want to be too forward here, but I've read most of your posts on this forum and I think people would be in a better place to help you out if you maybe answered some fundamental questions:

1) How old are you? Not entirely relevant, but it might help gauge your experience.
2) How much experience do you have in making films? List as much as you can remember, whether it be shooting a short with friends or working as a random crew member on a larger film.
3) Do you have any formal education in film-making (like a course or a college degree)?
4) Have you read any books on film-making? What specifically? (e.g. sound design or camera work or anything else?)
5) Is your 75k budget strictly for the feature film you've written, or is it for buying equipment as well (sound gear, cameras, etc)?
6) Who do you have on your crew? Do you have an experienced DP, and if so, how experienced is he? Any other members? Any friends willing to help out, etc?
7) What kit do you currently have? I know you have a camera, do you have anything else, like a tripod, a field recorder, lights...?

This information would give people an idea of what would be the next logical step to helping you make your film.
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1. I am 26.
2. I have helped out on one set and have done a little acting but that's it. Not much film going on where I live.
3. I have no course just books, I've read. I wanted to go to college but I was told by many that the money would be much better spent making my own film, and that most directors are more successful that way.
4. I have read on directing, and producing, but the books are not here now, and don't remember the exact titles. I have read books and articles on how to film the types of scenes I want as well, and how to capture the sound.
5. The budget is for buying equipment as well.
6. I have an experienced DP who is my friend and he has worked on music video and television broadcasts and interviews before. Me and him are practicing on filming the way I will require such as filming and editing certain types of action scenes he has not done before, but has taken courses in how to.
7. I have a tripod, no lights but will get those later, on the advice on my DP, of what to get. I have a field recorder on order now.
 
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Personally I think you are jumping in to deep water. I don't know if this $75'000 is just something you have set aside or if it's your life savings or what, but I think after this you are going to be $75'000 worse off than when you started.

I would think about the strategy you have for reaching your goal of making a feature film. To me it seems like you're desperate to get rid of this money without having much of a plan.
 
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Make something cheaper (far cheaper) first... otherwise, you'll just be throwing away $75,000... I guarantee it. Learn your "Chops" first, then make this masterpiece.
 
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Thanks for answering those questions man, you're far more experienced than I thought you were, more so than I am, anyway! My recommendations would be the same as the guys above, make some low budget throwaway movies for practice, especially incorporating the skills you'll need for your feature.

As for sound, find a sound guy with his own gear. If you can't, find someone dedicated who will do sound for you for free, for your practice movies and your feature and buy a low budget cardioid Mic like the NTG-2, a boom pole and a shock mount. Sell the NTG-2 and upgrade and get a decent cardioid when your sound guy is good enough, and a get a shotgun for outdoors.

That's what I would do, but it might be worth hearing a pro's opinion first :) Good luck, man.

BTW which field recorder did you get?
 
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I got the FR2-LE. It has been said on this site numerously that that's good for a cheaper one. I will order a mic but still researching which one to get. I am going to make at least one short film before I do the feature. The short film is a subplot from the feature that I took and turned into a short, but the big twist ending will be given away in the short before the movie, so hope that's not too bad. Not like many people will see the short though, outside of the festivals.

Now I could do more shorts after but then I will have less money for the feature, so depending on how the short goes, I am hoping to be good enough to do the feature after. Of course me and my DP friend will be doing lots of practice shooting and editing before we do the short, and especially before we do the feature.
 
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LastSunsetFilms said:
Personally I think you are jumping in to deep water. I don't know if this $75'000 is just something you have set aside or if it's your life savings or what, but I think after this you are going to be $75'000 worse off than when you started.

I would think about the strategy you have for reaching your goal of making a feature film. To me it seems like you're desperate to get rid of this money without having much of a plan.
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More like life savings :(. I am not desperate to get rid of money. I just wanna make a feature after my short.
 
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harmonica44 said:
More like life savings :(. I am not desperate to get rid of money. I just wanna make a feature after my short.
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Even if I thought I was ready to make a feature and had that money I wouldn't put all of it into a film, might as well buy 75'000 lottery tickets.

I'm not trying to put you off, but I think you should slow down and make a few shorts, perhaps sequences from your script, and then you have something to show you can do it, and then look at getting funding through kickstarter or something like that.
 
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Read most comments above. Really good advice given across the board. My only two cents, something not mentioned above that has always helped me in editing audio. Record lots of ambient sound ! Whenever and wherever you may roam with a camera -- get lots of ambient sound with best mic you can afford...
 
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I am trying to make no budget shorts and have a couple of people interested in working on their craft. I will do that first for sure. It's hard finding people that are interested and when it comes to hiring a sound person, so far a lot of them seem to wanna be paid. But I will continue to look for ones working on their craft.
 
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LastSunsetFilms said:
Even if I thought I was ready to make a feature and had that money I wouldn't put all of it into a film, might as well buy 75'000 lottery tickets.

I'm not trying to put you off, but I think you should slow down and make a few shorts, perhaps sequences from your script, and then you have something to show you can do it, and then look at getting funding through kickstarter or something like that.
Click to expand...

What is kickstarter? A company that funds projects?
 
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