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workflow with subtitles - HD video on laptop

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diapolical

I am making a documentary.
It is set in a non-English speaking community.
I have had all the clips translated into English but I have not matched the translations to the unedited clips, at the moment they are simply stored in a word file with beginning and end times noted.
The problem is that I cannot edit the film unless I know what the people are talking about, which means I need to see the translations when I view the clips.

One idea is to hard code the subtitles to every clip that they are needed in. So that I will have an entirely new set of clips. But it would be very time-consuming since there are 200 clips.
I think that maybe there is a more efficient way way of working with subtitles?.
Should I at least start by making srt files for each clip?

I would appreciate some suggestions about workflow.
 
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Since you will be forced to edit with subtitles on account you don't natively understand the language it appears the best approach is to:
  1. subtitle each clip,
  2. assemble final edit,
  3. save,
  4. note each clip's begin and end time down to the frame,
  5. then rebuild the whole thing without subtitles.

However, I imagine both the subtitled and the clear product will both have good use, so it's no real loss.

And perhaps you can pre-edit out some of the 200 clips. :yes:
 
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Ray was kinda hinting at this, and moving in the same direction here.. but basically, I think your best bet is going to be to render out a 'burn in' copy with timecode and all the subtitles in place.

Do your edit with that, then go back and relink the footage to the non-subtitled version, and add the subtitles as an appropriate subtitle track when you deliver dvd, or to web. Unless they are to be burned in at any point on the video, in which case, just burn them in again. :)


Where the method I've suggested and what Ray describes differ, primarily, is steps 4 & 5 will become automatic, as you'd simply relink the source footage to non subtitled footage.
 
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subtitle each clip?

Thanks to RAYW and Will Vincent.

The subtitles will be in the final film by the way, they are not just to guide me, the editor.

I think RAYW is suggesting to hard code the subs onto the clips, then edit with these clips, then rebuild the edit using clips without subs. Whereas Will Vincent suggests just relinking to (same named?) clips that haven't got the subs attached. (I would simply copy the project file into a folder that contained the unsubtitled-clips having the same name - the editor wouldn't know the difference I suppose)

I think I will amalgamate the advice so far, so ..............
===================================
I will hard code the subs (make "burn-in" copies) into a duplicate set of clips (originals are H264 so I could make AVID or Matrox versions, but they will have the same names, i.e. *mov). I'll make the edit. Then if the subs are wrong in any way (based on the editing decisions, and/or because of color correction necessities), I'll replace those clips with the original clips, those without the subs, and then redo the subtitles in the final project.

TO GET THE SUBS INTO THE CLIPS]
I have already made low res versions of all the clips, with just enough resolution to see who is speaking and when. These low res clips are recognized by the subtitle editor, unlike the H264 mov originals. I'll use these low-res to help me make srt files, I can put the subs in just the right place if I can see the video in the subs editor. I can import the srt files into Vegas or Premiere and hard code them into full res copies of the originals, maybe AVID versions since these edit so well. I'll do the final edit with the hard coded AVID/H253 copies.

Or should I add the subtitles in the the video editor and do away with making SRT files?
 
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Well, the point of the srt files is so that when viewing the video you can watch with or without subtitles.. if you do it in the editor those subtitles (I think) would have to be burned in, so you'd never be able to turn them off. Maybe not an issue, though is someone who speaks the language of the interviewees is watching it might be distracting.
 
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The subs will definitely be hard coded in since the film won't be seen by the original language speakers.
But is it easier to make an srt film for an individual clip then import the clip and srt into the editor or is it easier to add the subtitles inside the video editor and do away with making an srt altogether?
 
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Not sure.. I've not done much with subtitles.. I think Premiere will let you import an srt subtitle file and burn it into the picture. Presumably some other NLEs provide similar functionality as well.

Certainly seems that would be much easier than manually dropping title cards with the subtitle text over your timeline though. Without seeing the file you have to work with, just based on your description of it, it sounds like you already have the srt file, or maybe some other similar format though?
 
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A guy on another forum said not to bother subtitling anything till the final cut was made, his workflow is very different. He wrote the following ........

I do this all the time but I never bother subtitling all of the rushes. I work out the structure on paper (well, using a word processor, but you know what I mean), then place each section that I want on the timeline and put the subtitles on it (copy & paste from the translation into the title tool). I don't "burn in" the subtitling to a copy of the rushes.

I will probably then remove a third or a half of what I've assembled as I refine the cut, but it saves the time of subtitling a lot of material that wouldn't make the cut.

Now, I'm invariably working with interviews where I will only use in the region of one to five minutes out of half an hour or an hour of recording and it works well for that. It would be less than ideal for assessing the subtle differences between alternative takes of a performance, but to do that you'd need a good understanding of the language anyway.

I'll see how far my "paper plan" for the final edit gets by just reading the translations while watching the clips. If I get too confused then I will resort to making SRT files for all the clips that might go in the final edit, I'll leave out the definite rejects. That way I can see the subtitles by just opening the clips in an ordinary video player.
And I will work it out on paper. I'll see how this goes. I'll import the subs into Vegas/Premiere for the clips that are to be in the final cut then refine the timings etc.

Most of my clips are not interviews but live interactions between native speakers.

I hope this will be of help to some other people looking for information on developing a workflow for dealing with subtitles.
 
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