What's wrong with Hollywood?

The thing is that Hollywood is meant to just be pure harmless entertainment that makes a lot of money. Most of today's Hollywood films don't entertain me personally, I much prefer the Hollywood of the 1910's-1970's, and I much prefer the commercial cinema of Hong Kong for 'entertainment' films. But contemporary Hollywood satisfies viewers that are into that kind of film, so it doesn't really bother me, I'll just try to work outside of Hollywood.

I will say this though, I don't see why movies have to be "just entertainment." They started that way but very soon after that changed with D.W. Griffith, Soviet montage, and the countless cinematic treasures from all over the world ever since. Even Hollywood films weren't "just entertainment" most obviously in the 1970's New Hollywood era and in the classical 'auteurs.' But I suppose some people are fine with "just entertainment." I would argue that even today there are still filmmakers in Hollywood that make films that offer more than "just entertainment," I just think there are very few.
 
By “Hollywood” I will make the assumption that we are discussing the
studios. Not filmmaking in general but the movies made and distributed
by the major studios.

The studio system has never been ONLY about “just entertainment”.
Filmmakers and studio heads have always strived to make “important”
films; films that raise awareness of issues important to them and to
society. Some still do it today. However the movies that make money are
movies that allow the audience to escape from “issues” and enjoy a couple
of hours. So, as most of us have said, “Hollywood” follows the money.

Fortunately there are still producers, writers and directors who want to
make more important films. Fortunately there is always the non-studio
system. What I do not see is that “Hollywood” is clouding our perceptions
of the issues we're facing right now. We are more than what movies we
pay to see. We all have our opinions on the issues we're facing right now
and I do not believe “Hollywood” clouds those perceptions.

I agree with Firm1 that the studios so not make many “issues” films. But
I don't find that scary. For me, I get my information on issues like modern
day racism, the dynamic make up or modern day wars, and the holistic
understand of human consciousness not from Hollywood but from many
other sources. Frankly I wouldn't trust “Hollywood” to tackle issues like
that nor do I really care what most writers, producers and directors in
Hollywood have to say on those issues. They live in an insulated world.

A great topic of discussion, Firm1.
 
Hollywood is about the safe bet over the risk. They look at spread sheets over art. It is the independent filmmaker and "amateur" filmmaker who takes the risk with stories of race, social status problems, and emotional issues.

The occasional studio film that makes you think is made because it is propelled by someone studios and investors feel comfortable with having a strong resume of past success.

This is me, so post your thoughts as well, Lucy is a studio film because Luc Besson propelled it. If an unknown person was trying to sell it, an independent producer or amateur filmmaker would have made it instead. The story is not typical of a studio to make a film that makes viewers think and presents scientific theories above the usual reading grade level studio films are made to target.

I do like some studio films for mindless entertainment when I check my brain in at the door. But, I prefer independent films and amateur films for their more original content in spite of low production values and technical problems.

With studio execs, it's all about the money and shooting for safe profit over risk. Track records play an important role in what they choose to go with.
 
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I wish there were more filmmakers like Oliver Stone.

Harvey Weinstein has always produced great movies with social commentary, and still does, AND he makes money. So it's possible, just a little risky.
 
And I was just thinking that social commentary in movies is not necessary. People make movies for whatever reason. Some people make them because they want to terrify the audience, some people want to make the audience laugh, some people want to make the audience think, some people want to inform the audience, and lots of other reasons. I'm not sure any reason is more worthy of praise than another. It's the movies. Watch what you like. Make what you like. Entertain.
 
On the bright side, perhaps, we can think of movies that actually do attempt to challenge.

Forgive me, I typically don't know which movies are studio movies and which are not. And, after all, isn't it true that a lot of movies not made by the studios but that still get much distribution have some studio involvement?

Anyway, just trying to keep it to the 2010s, then, to cite some really current examples, I think we can come up with a list of movies that have attempted to do more than just provide "mindless" entertainment along the lines you've asked for.

12 Years a Slave. About African-American issues. Won Academy award for Best Picture. Not a Hollywood film? Even if it isn't, Hollywood still gave it its biggest award.

Django Unchained. About African-American issues. Racism and slavery.

Green Zone. An unflattering look at the invasion of Iraq.

Captain America: The Winter Soldier. Also includes an unflattering if fictional look at practices of the contemporary...establishment. Ripped from the headlines: such issues as widespread surveillance by the secret police as well as the issue of assassination by drone.

X-Men: Days of Future Past. The franchise continues it's exploration of how those who are different are marginalized and persecuted --the LGBT experience often having been described as the particular subtext of these films.

Star Trek: Into Darkness. About a military-industrial complex run amok under the pretense of fighting terrorism.

Then there are other less conventional films that perhaps weren't made by the Studios. But they get made and enjoy relatively wide distribution and access by movie lovers.

One very recent and daring example that comes to mind is Under the Skin. Not made by a studio, I suppose. But still, it has a major Hollywood star and is enjoying relatively wide access, at least now that it's on video and video on demand. Maybe it doesn't push the boundaries that you'd like to be pushed, but for sure, it pushes and even breaks some boundaries and conventions. And it's not even French; well, that's kind of the point I'm making.

And I bet we could think of a number of other such films.

So maybe not all of those big Hollywood movies mentioned above are explicitly issue driven. But, it seems to me that they still manage to sneek in some relavent and even substantive commentary, not to mention food for thought.

Kind of like giving the audience a little sugar (or maybe a lot of sugar) with the medicine.

=)
 
Personally, I thought “Dawn Of The Planet Of The Apes” was far from being a "mindless" film. It challenges our perception of humanity, what it means to be human, and asks us how we’d react to such a catastrophic event. And it does that while masked behind some great action set pieces and possibly some of the best CGI work I’ve ever seen. Sure, you can take from it whatever you will. See it as no more than just entertainment, or delve deeper and look for the underlying themes. Whatever suits you best.

I think “Hollywood” did a great job there.
 
richy said:
So maybe not all of those big Hollywood movies mentioned above are explicitly issue driven. But, it seems to me that they still manage to sneek in some relavent and even substantive commentary, not to mention food for thought.

Kind of like giving the audience a little sugar (or maybe a lot of sugar) with the medicine.
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Yes, and I think that's how it should be done in a commercial cinema because they can still appeal to wide audiences while making something that's actually worth watching for more than just spectacle. My main problem with today's Hollywood films is the writing (as in the dialogue) and the film technique which is really off-putting. What happened to actually staging scenes, beautiful compositions, somewhat lengthy shots, and coherent editing? And I don't really care for the characters, most of the movies now seem to be so plot-driven that I'd rather compare them to roller coasters than to classical cinema. I don't necessarily want Hollywood tackling big issues if they're having a hard time entertaining me with genre films that I want to enjoy as pure genre films (but they still make money, so they don't have to entertain me personally, so it doesn't matter to them nor to me since I get my entertainment elsewhere).
 
Firm1 said:
I agree but, I still feel that Indi films are limiting. They don't appeal to a mass audience. There's gotta be a way to create a self-sustaining online engine that generates well-made productions at the same rate that Netflix and Xfinity do and be able to convey them both online and at the movie theaters.

We're seeing a lot of great Indi films being made but they're individual pieces and they're only reaching a specific niche. There's gotta be a better/more naturalistic way to create films.
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i'm not sure what you mean by naturalistic. If an indie film couldnt go far it wasnt good enough. Thats what i meant by not being easy
 
Firm1 said:
Exactly! Hollywood is reflection of what we want and we just want...Nothing. But, shouldn't we be inspired to go further with stories? Shouldn't we strive to be more inventive and mind-boggling? It's like we all want the T.V dinners instead of the gourmet meal because we've never tasted anything better than what we're getting.

I'm not saying we should start brain-washing society. Rather, we should inspire society to develop new ideas for themselves.
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your starting to think like a real artist instead of a lousy filmmaker
 
Not good enough is not the whole story. Having a PR firm with a big budget for advertising and marketing helps to get films known. Having a good product is just part of the battle.
 
directorik said:
And who better than you to get that started?

New innovation begins with someone like you - someone who sees the
problem and works to find the solution.
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Thanks for the inspiration, man! And yeah, I agree with you about Hollywood. It's not my cup of tea but, it certainly is for a good number of people. It's just the way it is, I suppose.
 
richy said:
I think I'm just fine with Hollywood providing us with escapism. More than fine. In fact, quite pleased with it. Thrilled.

Yes, a certain amount of more challenging drama would probably be nice too. But it actually does get made, at least around the edges, even if few and far between. But I suspect such content almost by definition has to be made around the edges. (Or, apparently, on premium television.) That sort of content is by nature not as popular by comparison. And, importantly, not as likely to create a profit. Naturally. That's why it gets made around the edges. If at all.

If you mean to say you want more movies about racism and war, then you've lost me. I mean, that's fine, if that's what you want. But I don't want. I think contemporary life, at least for those of us who do not have our heads buried in the sand, is in fact saturated by relentless drama surrounding those things. Those things inundate our lives thanks to other media. The papers. Television. The internet. Books and Magazines. Yada yada yada, ad nauseam. There's already a din of such noise all around us. I don't understand it when people say there isn't enough already; they want even more.

Generally, I do want escape from a movie. Mind-boggling would also be very nice. But then, too, mostly in the service of entertainment. And good luck boggling the minds of twenty-first century audiences. (Meant sincerely of course, not snarkily.) By that I simply mean it must be extraordinarily difficult to boggle anyone's mind with a movie these days.

Come to think of it, though I won't try to make it here and now, you can easily make the argument that movies and TV (both largely Hollywood these days, aren't they? ...owned by the same corporations?) have done some very significant things, if at the time seemingly small, but leading to some significant social changes, if that's what we're talking about here, over the last couple decades.

Okay. one example. Whether you're (meaning anyone) happy with its impact, or not. Will & Grace. I'm guessing it hasn't been scientifically studied, if that's even possible. But I would bet that one show went a long way towards mitigating the demonization of gay men...at least in America. Well, maybe, at least, to some (possibly) measurable degree.

?

=)
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Yeah, that's a valid point. But, I wasn't necessarily talking about getting rid of escapism in movies or emphasizing war and race in the literal sense. Rather, I just think we need to update our common themes to fit something that's a little more modern. But hey, to each is own, right? That's what makes films so interesting because there is no right or wrong way to do it.
 
mussonman said:
I think Hollywood is actually just fine the way it is. Movies have never been better IMO. I don't think it clouds our perceptions of any issues we face because it is just entertainment. That's like that old myth that entertainment only exists to distract you from important things going on in the world. Well, it never has
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I'm inclined to disagree to some extant. I definitely think there are movies out there that are merely created for the sake of entertainment but I honestly feel that most movies are at least in part, trying to say something even if its not that deep. It's all one giant reflection just like our dreams and how we reflect our reality in the stories we create while sleeping.
 
sfoster said:
Check out some of christopher mcquarries other work if you haven't seen it.
Jack Reacher (also with tom cruise)
Way of the Gun
The Usual Suspects

I am really excited to see edge of tomorrow, I've listened to the sound track a bunch of times and everyone says such great things about it. Haven't looked forward to a movie this much in a long time. Finally comes out on DVD next month!
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Holy fuck, Christopher Mcquarries did the Usual Suspects?! That's my favorite movie!! No wonder Edge of tomorrow was so cool.
 
MiniJamesW said:
The thing is that Hollywood is meant to just be pure harmless entertainment that makes a lot of money. Most of today's Hollywood films don't entertain me personally, I much prefer the Hollywood of the 1910's-1970's, and I much prefer the commercial cinema of Hong Kong for 'entertainment' films. But contemporary Hollywood satisfies viewers that are into that kind of film, so it doesn't really bother me, I'll just try to work outside of Hollywood.

I will say this though, I don't see why movies have to be "just entertainment." They started that way but very soon after that changed with D.W. Griffith, Soviet montage, and the countless cinematic treasures from all over the world ever since. Even Hollywood films weren't "just entertainment" most obviously in the 1970's New Hollywood era and in the classical 'auteurs.' But I suppose some people are fine with "just entertainment." I would argue that even today there are still filmmakers in Hollywood that make films that offer more than "just entertainment," I just think there are very few.
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Yeeeah, pretty much. It's sad but who knows. Maybe we'll be inspired to do more with film and transcend beyond what we thought we were capable of? Story-wise, that is.
 
directorik said:
Fortunately there are still producers, writers and directors who want to
make more important films. Fortunately there is always the non-studio
system. What I do not see is that “Hollywood” is clouding our perceptions
of the issues we're facing right now. We are more than what movies we
pay to see. We all have our opinions on the issues we're facing right now
and I do not believe “Hollywood” clouds those perceptions.

I agree with Firm1 that the studios so not make many “issues” films. But
I don't find that scary. For me, I get my information on issues like modern
day racism, the dynamic make up or modern day wars, and the holistic
understand of human consciousness not from Hollywood but from many
other sources. Frankly I wouldn't trust “Hollywood” to tackle issues like
that nor do I really care what most writers, producers and directors in
Hollywood have to say on those issues. They live in an insulated world.

A great topic of discussion, Firm1.
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Thanks! I'm a little obsessed with these things, haha. I can't wait to see what we do with film in the future!
 
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