In the scene you saw, there is no drama, there is no climax, nothing particular to infer, that is so crucial that there needs to be special music during that scene. It's just two people having a conversation getting to know each other. There is no climax. Why can't a scene just be a normal scene? I like my movies as close to normal life as possible. Certain scenes are dramatic, but most scenes are subdued. Every scene is not a piece of art. It's just a depiction of boring everyday life.
Wow! Either you're completely misunderstanding what I'm trying to explain, I'm misunderstanding what you're saying or you have a fundamental misunderstanding of human interaction/communication and of storytelling.
1. You state that certain scenes are dramatic and others subdued. This indicates you are at least partially thinking about shape on the global scale of your film, about the relationship/contrast of dramatic vs subdued. Your statements and your previous example short indicate that you're not thinking about shape so much on the smaller scale, within each scene. Every spoken sentence/phrase has shape; slight changes of pace (minute pauses and speed-ups), words with more or less emphasis/intensity than others, changing pitch/intonation, etc. On a bigger scale, conversations/scenes also have their own shape; changes in banality and importance, an ebb and flow as people skirt around or lead up to their main point/s for engaging in a conversation in the first place.
2. If you were trying to create a scene with no drama, you failed! If you were trying to create a scene with no inferences, you also failed! In "normal life", two people "getting to know each other" is by definition inherently dramatic and packed with inferences. The questions we ask, the answers we give and receive and, the expressions, eye movements, body language and demeanour in response to those questions and answers is precisely how two people get to know each other! Either inadvertently or by design, your cafe scene is full of drama, changes of pace and direction, potential inferences and climaxes. For example, at 0:35 when asked why she moved to Toronto, our female character gave a fairly terse, evasive answer, looked intensely at the male character, looked down and then back again and then changed the subject. Maybe this has particular significance to the story, something in her past which is going to affect her actions and form the whole basis of your story or maybe it's nothing more sinister than she simply doesn't feel like elaborating and it has no significance to your story. Almost every statement, response and eye movement in this scene has one or more potential inferences. So many potential inferences in fact, it's difficult as a viewer to know which (if any) have particular significance to the story. As the filmmaker you know where the story is going and what is or is not significant in this scene, the audience does not! If there truly is no drama, no climax/es and nothing to infer or of any significance, why is this scene even in your film?
You're telling me you couldn't opine on whether enhancing the car sound on the street would make a difference to the scene, without knowing the whole story? Really??? I don't know what sound design is but it's difficult for me to believe that it's so precise an art that unless the whole story is known, any effort at enhancing a scene, is kind of useless, because it's not perfect. We're definitely not going to achieve perfection at my budget levels.
Yes absolutely, "Really"! In fact, I would go further than your statement and say that: Any effort at "enhancing a scene" without knowing the whole story is actually far worse than "kind of useless"! On the big or small screen an audience are not witnessing normal life, they are watching a 2 dimensional screen and listening to speakers rather than hearing real people/things. Different camera angles, lighting, edits, changes in perspective/POV and sound design are all ways of enhancing a scene, of intensifying the salient words/actions to suspend the audience's disbelief and improve their experience of and engagement with your story. How can I, as a sound designer, improve the audience's engagement and experience of your story, if I don't know what the story is? I'm working blind, maybe I need to enhance the incident I used as an example above (@ 0:35), maybe I need to down play it or maybe I need to forget about it because it's irrelevant. Maybe I need to enhance instead where the male character says he moves every 6 months because it's a pivotal motivation for some of the actions/events to come or maybe it's again completely irrelevant to the story.
Tying this together with points #1 and #2 above, it's not and can't be a question of whether there is or isn't any climaxes or point of interest, it's a question of where and what they are, and how big/dramatic. In your short, we were talking about an extreme scene and using howling helicopter jet engines blended with a scream. In this cafe scene there doesn't appear to be anything anywhere near that extreme, although until your last post I had no way of knowing. This could just as easily have been an extremely sinister scene, for example one of the characters could have been a heinous serial killer and with this scene we (the audience) are witnessing the initial stages of a victim being "groomed". As I've now been informed that it's just an unremarkable and subdued scene, then obviously no morphing or exploding espresso machines! More likely, just a constructed cafe ambience, with the occasional element (such as an ordinary espresso machine, patron's laughter, a car going by, etc.) poking it's head slightly above the background ambience to enhance the salient points (climaxes) and/or a lowering of one of the ambience elements (say the walla) to intensify an action/reaction and create shape. All done rather subliminally rather than overtly, to maintain a subdued feel overall. Although I now have a better general understanding of the context of your scene, I still don't know the specifics of the story and so I still can't say exactly what sound effects need to poke their head through the background, when this should happen or by exactly how much.
And please, I don't need a lecture on what storytelling, and filmmaking is about and how it all needs to be exciting.
With all due respect, you do appear to need a lecture on storytelling/filmmaking because you don't seem to be equating basic sound design principles with storytelling/filmmaking. I never said it all needs to be exciting, I said it all needs to be
engaging. Audiences can be engaged by a gentle drama, it doesn't have to be a high octane mega budget action/adventure. Regardless of genre though, there still has to be shape and pace or there will be boredom instead of engagement!!
G
