Recording in noisy surroundings
- Thread starter matan869
- Start date
I shot this downtown Houston. LOUD streets.. yelled cut when bus was right next to actress....Used lavs and a digital recorder.
the street is just 2 feet on the other side of the tree on the left
Dialog starts at 1:27ish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81STUoeR-HY
the street is just 2 feet on the other side of the tree on the left
Dialog starts at 1:27ish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81STUoeR-HY
ROC is right -- you're kind of screwed for audio in a noisy location.
I wouldn't green (or blue) screen it, though. I'd go ahead and shoot your noisy crappy audio in the location you want, and just use it as a scratch track, then go back and record the whole thing ADR, then foley.
I wouldn't green (or blue) screen it, though. I'd go ahead and shoot your noisy crappy audio in the location you want, and just use it as a scratch track, then go back and record the whole thing ADR, then foley.
You use a combination of preproduction, the proper tools and techniques.
First, you have to examine the script; do you absolutely have to shoot on the main street? If absolutely unequivocally yes, scout the location to find the less busy times of day, then set up your shots to minimize the noise coming into the mic(s). In other words, don't have the characters with their backs directly to the noise.
Use a shotgun mic and lavs; monitor the audio carefully. A skillfully wielded shotgun will yield the best signal to noise ratio. Well placed lavs are also a very viable option.
When shooting is completed capture copious ambient sound.
In audio post you strip out the noise between lines of dialog and fill the "holes" with the ambient sound or greatly reduce the noise volume between lines of dialog. You can use the dialog from close-ups during 2-shots, etc. Your last option should be ADR.
With the proper planning, techniques and tools you can usually avoid ADR.
First, you have to examine the script; do you absolutely have to shoot on the main street? If absolutely unequivocally yes, scout the location to find the less busy times of day, then set up your shots to minimize the noise coming into the mic(s). In other words, don't have the characters with their backs directly to the noise.
Use a shotgun mic and lavs; monitor the audio carefully. A skillfully wielded shotgun will yield the best signal to noise ratio. Well placed lavs are also a very viable option.
When shooting is completed capture copious ambient sound.
In audio post you strip out the noise between lines of dialog and fill the "holes" with the ambient sound or greatly reduce the noise volume between lines of dialog. You can use the dialog from close-ups during 2-shots, etc. Your last option should be ADR.
With the proper planning, techniques and tools you can usually avoid ADR.
Nevermind my advice. I like Alcove's better.
Honest question, though -- isn't it kind of common practice to ADR an entire movie, not as a backup plan but because that's what you want to do? What would be the advantages/disadvantages? Is it primarily budget?
I'm always fascinated by what Alcove comes up with for these situations. It's going to be hard for me to give up my guerrilla news instincts for film. I'm not used to having post when setting up a shot or a live shot. I learn so much from this place.
This is what I mean about planning the sound of a project during preproduction, because audio post shouldn't be about damage control. That's why you choose locations for their sound, not just their look. That's why you have one person who understands audio and does nothing else on the set. And that is what an experienced dialog editor brings to the table when supplied with all of the pieces of the puzzle.
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I know sometimes you must think after repeating things a few times that the knowledge isn't getting out there, but it is - and it's greatly appreciated.
I'd agree with Alcove that you plan carefully, and do what is possible to salvage the sound, but with the knowledge (and preparation by capturing plenty of ambient sound while you are there) that you might wind having to foley and ADR the entire thing.
Shoot somewhere quieter. (3 words)
I had a too smart for his own good DP on my last project (which fell apart). He would constantly ignore things like giant Coke trucks in the background, which he wanted to paint out in After Effects. I had to keep telling him to just change the angle several degrees, so there's no big Coke logo in my shot.
Needless to say, he painted out exactly zero frames in post.
I had a too smart for his own good DP on my last project (which fell apart). He would constantly ignore things like giant Coke trucks in the background, which he wanted to paint out in After Effects. I had to keep telling him to just change the angle several degrees, so there's no big Coke logo in my shot.
Needless to say, he painted out exactly zero frames in post.
Here is my last experience with this type of shot:
It was shot with a lav and a Schoeps MK41 (which has excellent rejection compared to a regular shotgun mic).
The lav was a low-quality jpeg and the Schoeps was a 40,000 megapixel photo that I could mold much easier with EQ - however, there was way to much traffic-wash and noise that could be taken out and handled for the mix. The lav did sound slightly better in terms of noise reduction, but it just sounded dull and honky and did not respond well to any amount of EQ I tried to place on it. I ended up having to use a CEDAR system to help it out while adding in real ambience under the dialogue to make it sound natural and breath like how it sounds out there.
The thing with those hidden lavs is that you have to boost sometimes 10-15 dB of high-end with a shelf to make it sound intelligible at all, and this adds back in all of that hiss and traffic noise you think you're not getting because of an expertly placed lav. Shooting with a lav also requires someone to be on headphones and actually listening to the recording while you're shooting because it's extremely easy to cause noise (and I mean a LOT of noise, like cloth rustle on a lav) that is absolutely impossible to remove in editing or mixing. They are very delicate and my experience with lavs is that you have to shoot a lot of extra shots due to noise and movement on them.
I'd look for a location that is off of the main streets of a city and has everything you need (brick wall, bus stop, etc.) that is baffled in by tall buildings on all four corners of the street and make sure there is not much foot traffic or cars at that time and shoot the scene between traffic light changes (so there are no cars going by during the shot).
And like a friend of mine once said about a shot he did in London last year, sometimes it's not wise to block off a street to try and get it quieter because there will be people who are now angered about not being able to drive through their normal routes to their donut shop in the morning and who then start honking and making more noise for you than they would have had the street been open to them.
That's your best bet I think.
It was shot with a lav and a Schoeps MK41 (which has excellent rejection compared to a regular shotgun mic).
The lav was a low-quality jpeg and the Schoeps was a 40,000 megapixel photo that I could mold much easier with EQ - however, there was way to much traffic-wash and noise that could be taken out and handled for the mix. The lav did sound slightly better in terms of noise reduction, but it just sounded dull and honky and did not respond well to any amount of EQ I tried to place on it. I ended up having to use a CEDAR system to help it out while adding in real ambience under the dialogue to make it sound natural and breath like how it sounds out there.
The thing with those hidden lavs is that you have to boost sometimes 10-15 dB of high-end with a shelf to make it sound intelligible at all, and this adds back in all of that hiss and traffic noise you think you're not getting because of an expertly placed lav. Shooting with a lav also requires someone to be on headphones and actually listening to the recording while you're shooting because it's extremely easy to cause noise (and I mean a LOT of noise, like cloth rustle on a lav) that is absolutely impossible to remove in editing or mixing. They are very delicate and my experience with lavs is that you have to shoot a lot of extra shots due to noise and movement on them.
I'd look for a location that is off of the main streets of a city and has everything you need (brick wall, bus stop, etc.) that is baffled in by tall buildings on all four corners of the street and make sure there is not much foot traffic or cars at that time and shoot the scene between traffic light changes (so there are no cars going by during the shot).
And like a friend of mine once said about a shot he did in London last year, sometimes it's not wise to block off a street to try and get it quieter because there will be people who are now angered about not being able to drive through their normal routes to their donut shop in the morning and who then start honking and making more noise for you than they would have had the street been open to them.
That's your best bet I think.
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