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IndieCinema.org Online Film Festival

A

Alex_Ruurs

Independent filmmakers are invited to submit short films for an online festival. The indiecinema.org is an online, ongoing independent film festival featuring documentaries, narratives and animations. Screen your work to a potential audience of millions! Visit indiecinema.org for more information and to download the entry form.
 
Welcome to indietalk!

One little question though.

It says on the entry form:

3. Submission of an entry automatically transfers unlimted exhibition, duplication and distribution rights for the entry to The IndieCinema.org. The media and the contents contained on the media becomes the property of The IndieCinema.org Film Festival.

What about entrants who would like to keep at least partial rights to thier films?
It seems a little unreasonable, and I wouldn't want to submit anything I considered "Quality" work of mine, because I would loose all rights to it. Do you ever work out deals for the filmmaker to be paid for thier film if it is sold?
 
Thanks for your question - I agree the wording of that second sentence is quite extreme. It exists only to protect us legally. We do not intend to sell or distribute the films that are submitted to us in any way other than by screening them online at the IndieCinema.org film festival (we won't be charging for the viewing of the films either by the way).

We want to promote independent filmmaking - not make money from other peoples films. In no way would we want to hinder a filmmaker from selling his/her film. The whole idea behind the IndieCinema.org is to get your film "discovered" so that someone might actually pay you for making it (or your next one at least)!

I am a little hesitant (for legal reasons) but I will seriously consider removing that second sentence from paragraph 3.
 
By all means, protect yourself legally- consult an entertainment lawyer and find out if it's indeed necessary for the festival to own all the movie rights. I understand where you're coming from, but from a filmmaker's perspective, loosing the rights means loosing everything. If anything, putting a time-limit on the rights (something like a year or two) would be good comprimise.

Even better (for the filmmaker) would be to offer non-exclusive rights, but then again, I wouldn't expect that much. Exclusive, limited, expiring rights are fair. I just think others might be hesitant to submit with a clause like that in a contract.
 
I have reworded the 3rd paragraph of the Festival Rules. Please download the updated version of the Entry Form available now from The IndieCinema.org. Any feed back is more than welcome.

The 3rd paragraph now reads:

3. Submission of an entry automatically transfers unlimited exhibition, duplication and distribution rights for the entry to The IndieCinema.org. The submitting filmmaker retains ownership of the film but grants to The IndieCinema.org all rights to exhibit and broadcast the work, including but not limited to, the right to exert clips, re-grant use, make, have made and own copies.

This will protect us legally (and allow us to screen the film online) but clearly awards the filmmaker continuing ownership of the film.
 
That certainly sounds a lot better... in any case, it's good to know these things can be worked out!

I do have a question though- do you have a lawyer go over the submission form and approve the language? Or do you use boiler plates and modify as needed?
 
I chose an existing entry form used by another well known film festival and used it as a framework for my own entry form. I haven't had my own lawyer look at it but I am confident that it is legally appropriate. The original entry form was drafted by an entertainment lawer and mine is very similar to the original. It is also very similar to other waivers that my own lawyer has drafted for me in the past.
 
Alex_Ruurs said:
3. Submission of an entry automatically transfers unlimited exhibition, duplication and distribution rights for the entry to The IndieCinema.org. The submitting filmmaker retains ownership of the film but grants to The IndieCinema.org all rights to exhibit and broadcast the work, including but not limited to, the right to exert clips, re-grant use, make, have made and own copies.

This will protect us legally (and allow us to screen the film online) but clearly awards the filmmaker continuing ownership of the film.
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By giving IndieCinema.org unlimited exhibition, duplication and distribution rights I would still own my movie but you would own all exhibition, duplication and distribution rights. So if another distributor were interested in my movie they would have to go to you for the distribution rights.

Good for you. Not so good for the filmmaker.
 
I agree, the distribution leaves the filmmaker with no recourse if you sell the work in any means they feel is inappropriate. It technically allows you to re-edit and redistribute versions at will.

You would also, according to this, be allowed to take individual clips out of the latest pro-christian indie hit, which you distribute, and distribute it (with full rights) to satanists to use in their latest recruiting advertisements...not that you would, but the wording of your contract makes that legal.

I will not sign up for anything that doesn't allow me to control my works at this point in my career. I think many of the filmmakers here feel the same (although I am not the voice of the board).
 
So if another distributor were interested in my movie they would have to go to you for the distribution rights.
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Not at all. The contract stipulates unlimited - not exclusive - rights. The filmmaker retains ownership which means he/she can do whatever they want with it including entering into an agreement with a distributer or buyer (and we would encourage that).

I agree, the distribution leaves the filmmaker with no recourse if you sell the work in any means they feel is inappropriate. It technically allows you to re-edit and redistribute versions at will.
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Technically, yes. But it does not say that we can sell the work, it says only "exhibition, duplication and distribution". All we want to do is show quality independent films to people which means that we need to have the rights for exhibition, duplication and distribution. We do not plan to re-edit anybody's work but we might wish to promote somebody's film with a trailer or various clips (in which case we would ask the filmmaker to approve the trailer or selected clips before we use them).

Submitting a film to any festival requires the filmmaker to display some faith. If the festival is well known and has a good reputation, less faith is required. I am very aware that The IndieCinema.org has no reputation or track record of any kind - we just launched a few days ago! The risks and concerns raised in this thread are valid and I would have the exact same hesitations. I can only ask that you keep an eye on us and let The IndieCinema.org prove itself over time to be a popular and trustworthy online film festival. I certainly don't blame you for being cautious - it's your work, you should be cautious with it!
 
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unlimited exhibition, duplication and distribution rights
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This means that you can show the film where ever and whenever you what.

It also means that you can create DVD's and distribute them.

So when I see my film on Amazon.com or anywherelse.com I can;t get money for it because you have distribution rights.
 
Either way, don't take any of this as "legal advice" because only a lawyer can do that. We're just making suggestions from the filmmaker perspective. In the end, only a lawyer makes it legal.
 
Alex_Ruurs said:
Technically, yes. But it does not say that we can sell the work, it says only "exhibition, duplication and distribution".
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And that’s a pretty big technicality. If you were to distribute the movies and make money, you technically have that right with this signed agreement.
Alex_Ruurs said:
Submitting a film to any festival requires the filmmaker to display some faith. If the festival is well known and has a good reputation, less faith is required. I am very aware that The IndieCinema.org has no reputation or track record of any kind - we just launched a few days ago!
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As Spatula said, we are only giving you our perspective as filmmakers. Since this is a new venture it might be better for you to err on the side of filmmakers, earn that reputation as fair and then ask for filmmakers to display some faith in you.

This is what’s great about this forum - you can get direct feedback from filmmakers. I’m not going to submit because of that clause, but I will check your site to see how things go. I know how hard it is so start something like this. Good luck!
 
Of course, if you get that reputation built up, you can also ask for nice quotes of trust to put on your website, or permission to use folks who have had good experiences through you as references. As a side note, when asking for references, I always ask for references who have had less than glowing experiences as well...people look at me funny, but it alows me to see how they deal with problems as well...and how confident they are in themselves.

I wait with baited breath to watch you develop a service I can use when I finish my feature ;)
 
And that’s a pretty big technicality. If you were to distribute the movies and make money, you technically have that right with this signed agreement.
Click to expand...

Since this is a new venture it might be better for you to err on the side of filmmakers, earn that reputation as fair and then ask for filmmakers to display some faith in you.
Click to expand...

I'd love to but I'm not sure how this can be done without putting The IndieCinema.org at extreme legal risk. According to lawyers that I have spoken with, showing a film online requiers nothing less than unlimited distribution and exhibition rights. The very nature of the internet makes this a difficult tight rope to walk. Again, we will not sell a film that we screen but anyone downloading the film might try to and that could be considered "our fault" (in reality, it would be next to impossible for anyone to sell an MPG version of somebody else's film). How can we safely and legally screen films without distribution rights?

I have an idea... Perhaps we could toss out this form and simply ask people to check a box that says "yes, I understand that my film will be made available for viewing online and The IndieCinema.org cannot be held liable for any damages or loss that may occur as a result of screening the film." or something along those lines. I will talk to a lawyer about this because I'd be surprized if that would afford enough protection but if it does - problem solved! That way we'd have no rights to do anything except "show the film online" which is all we want.

By the way - thank you all for your participation in this discussion, I'm finding it very helpful.
 
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This link is for a Manitoba festival PDF entry form, to which they will broadcast on TV and Online. It might be worth checking out the last page, with the lisence info. They have an expiring non-exclusive agreement. Check it out!


http://www.nsi-canada.ca/filmexchange/nex/NEXapplication_2005.pdf

EDIT: Not sure if it's LEGAL, per se, but I'd have to hope so, considering they will broadcast selected shorts on the Movieola channel...
 
Spatula, thanks for the example.

Eddie, yes - I'm afraid your film is too long. We only consider films under ten minutes. The reason I use a PO Box is that my home office is located in a residential area that does not recieve postal delivery service. Most of the town here must use PO Boxes.
 
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