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Grants?????

R

rbp2005

I am looking to do a For-Profit feature film..however I am not wealthy and I don't want to rely on bank loans alone. I have been reading some other threads in this section and it all seems to be for the non-profit documentary.

I live in Florida...any ideas about the grants in my state...namely the ones for filming in the sate or mentioning a city. Do I need to fully explain every detail about my film (like it being a full feature with adult scenes..porn with a storyline and SFX basically) or can I omit that and go about my business with a very general overview of the main concept of my film for a grant proposal?

Any other grants..perhaps non-film but ones aimed at small business and such? Can I apply for and accept more than 1? I was watching an infomercial on TV with that crazy guy who dresses like the riddler and talks about gov't grants that ppl don't even know about (he was on oprah as well and his book is for real) Has anyone attempted any of those for your films?
 
You're looking for grants and not investors?
A lot of the time you DO have to compete for a grant. I've seen it where they require a copy of the script.
Investors will more likely want to know the business plan, who's attached (cast and crew) and if there are any agreements with distribution, etc.

What is the budget for your film?
 
its basically up in the air right now..I am getting a bankloan in april...pretty much as much as i can rake up but possibly 15-20grand after equipment + whatever I can rake up in my grant research and such.
 
So what do you have right now? A script? Do you have anyone attached?
Who's the director?
Who's the DOP?
Editor?
Sound?
etc....

Do you need to buy the equipment or find a DOP that has their own?

Who's the producer?

Your FX, will they be done in post or in production or both?

Before you get a loan, have you figured out a business plan, marketing and all that?
 
CootDog said:
So what do you have right now? A script? Do you have anyone attached?

Who's the director? I am The Director
Who's the DOP? My Business Partner and a close friend with many Indie Films under his belt
Editor? Me -- Power Mac G5 Final Cut Studio
Sound? Still looking for a sound guy
etc....

Do you need to buy the equipment or find a DOP that has their own? Buying my own equipment..renting sound and light equipment

Who's the producer? Myself and my Business Partner

Your FX, will they be done in post or in production or both? Both

Before you get a loan, have you figured out a business plan, marketing and all that?
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Obviously my responces are in bold to the previous post.. I have a few script ideas and 1 script that is fairly far into development... my ideal start time of this project is not until Summer/Fall 2006.

Business plan I have not written out formally yet but I have an informal 1 that I wrote for myself, I am applying for personal loans however instead of a loan to the business or the film itself...less questions and less of a chance of being turned down because its an adult feature.

Marketing Is so far beyond taken care of at this point lol.... I work at an adult store as well as one of the largest clusters of radio stations in Florida. The Adult Store will distribute my film in its 3 locations at first and then we will talk about branching out from there..they will also sponsor the premiere. The Radio station..I am in good with the host of each talk show and they have already said that when its gets closer I can go the air with a few of them to put the word out on the number #1 station in town as well as promote the premiere and the pre-production casting call which I am in talks now with some close personal friends who happen to be influential in our local music scene to run a fundraising concert at a large venue to raise money for production cost and talent fees. As well as the promo teams for the radio stations broadcasting from the concert every so often before breaks to bring out some of their established fan base.

I am also trying to create a nice logo for my company to go on T-Shirts and booty shorts, hats etc to hand out at the event.

This is all planned out pretty well..only thing is I am looking to off set some of the personal cost to me, thats why I was hoping that perhaps grants may be the way to go. I did some research yesterday and it looks as if you have to submit a finished product to them and mostly documentaries and such are the ones with the most oppourtunities. Any grants that aim at the more risque pictures that you hear about at sundance and such?
 
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I'm misunderstanding, you're trying to find grants to make porn? Or trying to get a loan which you plan on using to make porn?

If that is the case, my personal opinion is that no grants exist to support a project which will have an NC-17 rating, and no bank will loan you money for a film of that nature, and any bank that gives you a personal loan will indeed request to know where that money will be spent. Further even if you could get a loan for it, bank loans are the most risky way to finance a film besides maxing your CC's. And getting a personal loan, not incorporating or forming a LLC or LLP for the picture means if your film makes no money you are screwed for life.

Personally, and I dont know a lot about making porn mind you as most of us are filmmakers who are trying to avoid NC-17 ratings, I would believe that 99% of all porn is bankrolled by 1 or 2 producers who have a secured distrobution package before even shooting, hence the ultra low cost to make porn is EASILY overcome by DVD sales. I wouldn't try to go down any other road if I were you.
 
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I am looking into forming an LLC with my lawyer.. I spoke with him last week about it. The personal loan would be in my name and I would do monthly payments *like a car payment*...even if the worst case scenario happened I would be responsable for the monthly payments for the term of the loan (4 to 6 years) all I would have to say would be that I am looking to fix up a house or something of that nature. No Maxing out of the credit cards required. My Business partner that 2nd producer you mentioned.. is also applying for a loan of the same nature to offset some of the production/talent fees. The film would be a XXX feature film with a run time of 2hrs 30 min distributed on DVD and VHS for $49.99 - $34.99 at 3 locations in the state of florida with a mail order option and website space on the store website... once the sales figures begin to roll in I have the option to branch out and furthur the deal.


The type of grant I would be looking for would be to pay for equipment etc so that I don't have such a large overhead of money owed. I am also interested in grants aimed at stimulating small business to help the economy, but all the film grants I have seen require you to submit the film for review... doesn't really help me if I need the $$$ to start my production. I am not really worried about my film not selling..adult features have a way of selling themselvesand I have ann excellent graphic artist and some stunningly beautiful women very interested in being apart of something big. Looking for info on ways to raise money..and perhaps sucess stories of people who have done an R rated or higher film that has been concidered controversial and some org took a chance on them. I really believe in this film..and I believe that it could be as big as "Deepthroat" was in the 70's...only problem is that I need money....and as much as I can get my hands on to bring that vision to life... be it a big loan..the lotto...or grants that help controversial films out.
 
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Ok let me explain this. If you include real sex in your film or even just a certain amount of frontal nudity it will be NC-17 which is unaccepted by every grant I have ever examined.

This is not a dispute over whether a film like this could be good, its about whether it is viable to cross the line into NC-17. Under NC-17= movie for general audiences. Over NC-17 = Not for general audiences. There are no grants for the latter, I believe.

We all need money for our films, and as I tried to tell you, you'd best find some private money to fund this rather than go down a different route, although I'm not sure a seasoned producer is going to want to fund a film with a story since all anyone wants in a porn DVD is 2hrs of porn and not a story.

But, good luck.
 
I understand what your saying..and honestly I do appreciate it...not trying to argue (downside to typing,,you can't get a feel for a persons tone) :)

With finding personal funders...is there away to do this and not lose creative control over my film. The idea is to work for myself not have a "boss" per-say... and storyline based films are making an incredible comeback in the past few months.....the porn-only dvds have become so old hat that people want something new.... look up a film called Pirates from Digital Playground... good story..good script..decent acting.... amazingly hot women and steamy scenes (6 in total) = more money than you would know what to do with lol.

Thats a big budget ($286,000 film the "Titanic" of Adult Hollywood) film but you can see where I am going with this..the couples market is something that has not been paid attention 2 in a long long time, and now its coming backin a big way.
 
rbp2005 said:
I understand what your saying..and honestly I do appreciate it...not trying to argue (downside to typing,,you can't get a feel for a persons tone) :)

With finding personal funders...is there away to do this and not lose creative control over my film. The idea is to work for myself not have a "boss" per-say...
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No, there would be ways of writing into the contract a certain amount of creative control but no decent investor (producer) will take a silent roll especially if they are bankrolling 100% of the cost of your film. I personally understand the desire to be your own boss and have nobody to answer to. But you would have to write yourself in as 51% producer in order to retain total control of your picture. On the short I am about to shoot, my producer will be providing 25% of the budget including assets he brings to the picture. Therefore I stand in good position to retain nearly total control of the picture (he has tried to bring ideas to the table which would take the story in a different direction and they have been shot down. One reasonable request he has made I will fulfill). If you were somehow able to retain 51% ownership of the film and in writing discuss that the film will be creatively controlled through post production as your own you might have a shot at it. But see for my short I am putting up a little of my own personal money for the budget in a way so I was able to basically demand my own terms.

Thats a big budget ($286,000 film the "Titanic" of Adult Hollywood) film but you can see where I am going with this..the couples market is something that has not been paid attention 2 in a long long time, and now its coming backin a big way.
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Well Ive seen Boogie Nights a million times so I understand where you are coming from but again we are not talking about the possibility for ROI, we are talking about a fundamental difference between your film and legitamite cinema, which is the necessity for an NC-17 rating, and since this stems from sexual scenes, this will label your film Porn of which no grants I believe exist for (for good reason too as most grants stem from donations and private funds controlled by non-profits or corporations of some type) and as far as I know there is no possible way to convince a bank to essentially bankroll a film containing pornography, as they too are corporations with strict guidelines.
 
thats why they would not be "funding a film containing pornography" lol they would be funding a personal loan to "remodel my house" ;) :yes: :lol:

and yeah I understand the whole.. grants are from public money and they would freak if it went to porn..concept. I guess I was hoping to just squeak by under some sort of "controversial film grant" which sadly does not exist :(
 
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WideShot said:
I take it you've never gotten a loan before, because that's not how it works.
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I got 1 for my car..didn't really ask a lot of questions and I never had to show them I actually bought a car. What would they require..cause the bank lady I talked to made it seem quite simple.

Lets say I go in and apply for the loan and say it is for a film.....do I need to spill the beans about every aspect of my film? Or can I give an overview of the film minus the 6 nude scenes?
 
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You typically have an itemized list and hire people or make purchases which you are then reimbursed for by the bank. These allotments are based from actual receipts and invoices, not word of mouth. They usually send someone to check on your progress several times, and then for final approval. A car loan is totally different, and as long as you continue to make your payments there is no issue but if you didnt they would repo your car, and if you didnt have that car, well you should read your loan application carefully.


Lets say I go in and apply for the loan and say it is for a film.....do I need to spill the beans about every aspect of my film? Or can I give an overview of the film minus the 6 nude scenes?


Banks usually do not loan for films. They might loan to a company for a project however, and there are other types of loans that you can get through a bank that are not straight up loans but a three-way type of deal (no not the three way you're thinking of).


I'm trying to tell you there is a reason why you dont hear about any porn being funded outside of private financiers.
 
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yeah I hear ya...

Any Idea if they have loans that work like a car loan that I can use for what I might need...what if I was getting a loan to pay my credit cards etc.... how would they check up on that... as long I make payments and they get their money back I really don't see why they would have an issue aside from the conotation (which I fully understand IS the issue)

I will def look into private investors but are there any "no questions asked until you miss a payment" kinda deals at any banks.
 
In short, no. Every bank would be out of business if they lended money like that.

I would also heavily advise you to not lie to a bank on an application for the purpose of the loan, I would assume this would be some type of a legal offense.
 
yeah I guess so... I was under the impression that a bulk majority of loans worked like a car loan...make payments everyone is happy... Sadly from what your saying that is not the case.

As I said earlier I am forming an LLC.. if I got a business loan to the LLC with them knowing that the money goes to the film, do I need to say that it is anything over an R-rating..its not lying on the app but its not coming and saying its an adult feature..opening myself up to blatant discrimination on the part of the bank. Who is to say that if they required a copy of the film I couldn't just send them an R-Rated Cut for viewing? Would that be legally wrong?
 
Ok well Im not prepared to give you legal advice or anything or tell you whether lying to the bank or sending them a false copy of your film would be legal.

At this point all I could do is suggest that even considering doing such is pretty shady and would likely end you up in legal trouble. I would consult my lawyer regarding this if I were you.

I'm also not entirely sure you can get a bank to loan yourself or your company money to make a film straight up. That is something you would have to ask them.

Before you go and do something you might regret, you might want to weigh the risks.
 
Porn is not (conceptually) controversial, the controversy arises in proving it's an artform as a pre-requisite to apply for a (fine arts) grant.

I believe that with a public funded grants agency (NEA, etc), it's MUCH harder to receive funding for such a work then privately funded programs which may be willing to entertain works with graphic images if THEY deem these are art. (Therein lies the catch-22.... what constitutes 'art' to them?).
 
There are MANY MANY avenues to get money for making Porn. I would suggest you look into the adult film industry. It is a very lucrative genre. Also I have NEVER heard anyone paying $49.99 for a DVD unless it was a training DVD. I'm not into porn so I don't know the going rate.

I am worried that you're going to get a loan for say, $30,000 and you still don't have a plan or know much about the entire process including marketing and distribution. Your $30,000 loan at 7% interest over 5 years will cost you over $500 per month. You will have to sell 721 DVDs @ $49.99, OR 1000 DVD's @ $29.99, OR 1,500 DVD's at $19.99 JUST to break even and that's if you're using part of the $30,000 to MAKE the DVDs. But that's if YOU sell them for Retail price. In order to do that you have to have a VERY good marketing plan.
Did you think about distribution? If you sell the DVD's for $5.00 wholesale, you need to sale over 6000 units to break even.

Like I said, Porn is a very popular genre and one that makes a lot of money. There's a lot more you have to worry about in production too. Make sure you check the laws in your state and city for the actual porn shots.

I have also never heard of a porn film being 2 and a half hours.

Make sure your lawyer is knowledgable in adult film law so you'll know what's legal and not. Perhaps you can look for a producer that will shoot this with their equipment, allow you to direct, etc... Conventional means to get funding won't work because your film is not conventional. Taking a second on the house is an option and you get to write off the interest and you get to fund the film and take all the risk. Don't forget about insurence.
 
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