Gain levels newbie

[IHMAEAM]

Hello,
i'll try to keep it quick. im trying to sort out an issue for a shoot i was involved in where the director wasn't happy with the sound quality

1. actor went from whisper to booming at a certain point and it clipped out. is it ok to adjust gain in anticipation of this outburst on the fly?

2. two actors speaking at very different volume, is it ok to adjust gain for each actors volume on the fly?

this is my thinking, now the director wanted -12 to -6 for this dialogue. the boom op didn't have much room to wriggle, but could pivot between the two. the quiet part ended up having the levels low (-30) to avoid clipping when the actor raised their voice. so it seemed to make sense to change the gain mid way for the outburst so its at least usable ????
and when two actors are involved they are at different volume because of distance and male to female difference
there are major differences in levels for the different setups and between actors, and the director still wants better sound for the quiet parts. what suggestions can i make for the rest of the shoot?

 

[Alcove Audio]

Yup, it's going to be like that.

(An) actor went from whisper to booming at a certain point and it clipped out. Is it okay to adjust gain in anticipation of this outburst on the fly?

Two actors speaking at very different volume, is it okay to adjust gain for each actors volume on the fly?

Yes, if you know the script well and can anticipate, most definitely adjust the volume on the fly; that's part of the job is when you're the production sound mixer. In fact that's what the job title is; production sound MIXER, so you are actively mixing the sound on the set; pretty old school these days, but low/no/mini/micro budget calls for real old school skill and talent to replace budget.

The director still wants better sound for the quiet parts. What suggestions can I make for the rest of the shoot?

You can suggest that the actor does not always have to shout loudly to be intense. Also, you can shoot quiet versions and loud versions if you have the time/budget. Whether either of these suggestions happens or not, you should definitely be capturing dialog wilds. And you are getting room tones, right?

In addition you should be running the recorder in Dual Mono mode; one channel of the two will be -20dB lower than the other to account for loud transients (like shouting). If your recorder does not have Dual Mono mode you can use a mic splitter to send the signal to both channels and manually lower the level on one of the channels. You can use a "Y" cable if your budget is extremely tight, but be aware that a "Y" cable will reduce input levels by as much as -6dB.

The guys you really want to "talk" to are on Jeff Wexlers site for production sound people; these folks do production sound for a living.

http://jwsoundgroup.net/index.php?

 

[AudioPostExpert]

this is my thinking, now the director wanted -12 to -6 for this dialogue. the boom op didn't have much room to wriggle, but could pivot between the two. the quiet part ended up having the levels low (-30) to avoid clipping when the actor raised their voice. so it seemed to make sense to change the gain mid way for the outburst so its at least usable ????

As Alcove said, but I would add that you have to be able to change the gain between lines of dialogue and not during it. The other consideration is that it not necessarily a problem having a line of dialogue recorded at -30dB, in fact in some cases it would be preferable to record dialogue at -30dB than at say -6dB and a whisper probably falls into that category. It would be worth explaining to the director that it maybe possible to record a whisper at -6dB (or -12dB) but he/she will probably end up with poorer quality audio than if it were recorded at -30dB.

G

 

[rocksure]

Yup, it's going to be like that.



In addition you should be running the recorder in Dual Mono mode; one channel of the two will be -20dB lower than the other to account for loud transients (like shouting). If your recorder does not have Dual Mono mode you can use a mic splitter to send the signal to both channels and manually lower the level on one of the channels. You can use a "Y" cable if your budget is extremely tight, but be aware that a "Y" cable will reduce input levels by as much as -6dB.

http://jwsoundgroup.net/index.php?

That's really good advice. Dual mono mode can really save your bacon on those parts where an unexpectedly loud peak occurs. It's kind of added insurance.

 

[harmonica44]

I'm sure you are right of course, but I've tested whispers on my recorder and it seems that they sound better recorded at -6. -30 has more hissing when you turn it up in post, unless their is something good about the sound quality at -30, besides the hissing?

 

[AudioPostExpert]

I'm sure you are right of course, but I've tested whispers on my recorder and it seems that they sound better recorded at -6. -30 has more hissing when you turn it up in post ...

There shouldn't be more hissing when you turn a -30 recording up to the equivalent of recording it at -6! If anything there would probably be less noise, although as always it depends on what you are recording and what you are recording with. Read this post.

G