do local indie film scenes really exist?

M

miketv

I came to film through the music scene, where bands form & break up & members are practically interchangeable (as long as there's a vaguely similar vision to work with). After a while you can't go out of the house without seeing somebody involved in the music scene, from sound techs to musicians to door guys to writers for the local press. It's a very active & densely-populated world. Always a project, always something to work on.

Where are these people in the film scene? I've been making movies for about half my life now, & I've never met another serious local filmmaker. I've even had my work in a handful of festivals & started my own festival one year, but I still haven't encountered anything like a "scene". I never run into a dedicated short script writer at a show, for instance, & none of my friends are wasting their lives away trying to be the next David Lynch.....but about half of my friends are wasting their lives away trying to be the next Keith Richards. Where are the local steadicam heroes? Where's the animation crew that's got everybody excited about this weekend's show?


Anyway, that's why I'm here. I keep hearing about film scenes, but I've never actually seen one. Maybe I can meet a local or two. Someone to 'jam with' (so to speak).
My name's Mike...I'm kinda new to Detroit. I write, animate, act & edit, and I'm learning my way around a camera. I'm currently working on 2 screenplays, a music video, an animated short film, a standup comedy routine, & some puppets. I'm not sure yet what the puppets will be used for, but I wouldn't recommend letting your kids watch.
 
We have two separate film groups the meet at least 3 times a month here in Columbus Ohio. Things like the 48 Hour Film Project area great place to meet like minded people.
 
It all depends on what you call a "scene". In the music biz - and I was involved for almost 30 years - is as you described. But you're out every night either playing or checking out other bands (while partying and looking to get laid).

You can sit at home by yourself and watch a film - maybe one or two like-minded friends will join you - and you have to actually pay attention.

You can't just jump into a film crew and "jam" or whip out a new movie in a couple of hours the way you can run into a studio and lay down some tracks.

And a lot of filmmaking needs to be solitary, or at least executed in a relatively calm environment like reading and writing scripts, preproduction, etc.

The whole culture is entirely different. DPs aren't as interested in heading off to a club to show off their new ink as a guitarist. Not many grips can learn three cords and join a film crew 'cause it's cool and they'll meet girls. Directors don't stand on the front of the stage and get panties thrown at them.

The film "scene" is when you head out to meet-and-greets once or twice a month and network, looking for actors and crew members, and commiserating with other fill in the blank (DPs, sound guys, writers, gaffers, etc.) and when you go to screenings, or work on your own or others projects
 
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There is one here in Houston TX..they get together using Meetup.com. Im sure there is something in Motor city, , Try Craigslist too.
 
Thanks for the feedback,all. I have been using meetup to find other groups....I should probably start looking for filmmakers there, eh? lol


A lot of insight there, AA, but I have to disagree with this part:
Alcove Audio said:
You can't just jump into a film crew and "jam" or whip out a new movie in a couple of hours the way you can run into a studio and lay down some tracks.
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That's exactly how I started making movies (more years ago than I care to mention). Someone breaks out a camera, someone comes up with a theme, a plot, or a little mise-en-scene, & we go at it. Just jamming. Sometimes the movies sucked, but a lot of times we would come up with really unique approaches to some of the more boring conventions of film-making. And it was always fun & we were always in practice. A 15 minute short could be finished in 2 hrs (plus another 2 hrs for the dual-VCR editing). I guess I just got lucky with that group of friends, maybe...

That's still my intention, though. Most of my work is digital animation & done solo nowadays, but I'm starting to feel that itch to work with cameras & props & people again. And I see no reason why others wouldn't be as interested in jamming as my friends & I were back in the day. I mean seriously....who's making money from movies nowadays, anyway? It's a labor of love, like rock & roll....we do it 'cause we have to....because there's an awesome scene in us that's got to come out, or because the movie we want to see just isn't out there yet.

I'm no-budget producer, so I understand I have a different perspective than most.
 
sonnyboo said:
We have two separate film groups the meet at least 3 times a month here in Columbus Ohio. Things like the 48 Hour Film Project area great place to meet like minded people.
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Sonnyboo....your name has been familiar to me for a long time now. I'm originally from SW Ohio (Dayton/Cincy area).By the persistence of your name's presence alone, I'm inclined to believe that you are another serious local filmmaker. You're about 3 hrs from me now....could I maybe I could sit in on a meeting sometime? I'd like to see what sort of "thing" you have going on....maybe I can pick your brain to form my own group up here....

I always look for crews to join on the 48hr competition, but I just don't know where to find them....seems they're usually sewed up by the time the local competition date is announced...
 
miketv said:
Someone breaks out a camera, someone comes up with a theme, a plot, or a little mise-en-scene, & we go at it. Just jamming. Sometimes the movies sucked, but a lot of times we would come up with really unique approaches to some of the more boring conventions of film-making. And it was always fun & we were always in practice.
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As SonnyBoo mentioned - check out the local 48 hour film project & similar timed competitions. They are much closer to what you are describing, and at least in our region (SF bay area) there's a small 'scene' of regular players who participate and do other screenings, etc. We also have a couple other similar local groups I'm aware of. MMTB (movie making throughout the bay - http://moviemakingbay.com) schedules one day 'jam sessions' where people get together at a location, come up with ideas and shoot them in an afternoon, then edit over the next month for a screening & competition. Scary Cow (http://www.scarycow.com) is more of a collective where people get together and develop larger projects, including raising funds and training people. If you don't have something in your area like any of these, maybe it's time to start one!
 
There's a huge community in MPLS, MN. St. Cloud has lots of groups that compete in competitions in MPLS, we just don't really get together much as so much of our community is an hour and a half away. Our various groups seem to be a bit insular.
 
miketv said:
That's exactly how I started making movies (more years ago than I care to mention). Someone breaks out a camera, someone comes up with a theme, a plot, or a little mise-en-scene, & we go at it. Just jamming. Sometimes the movies sucked, but a lot of times we would come up with really unique approaches to some of the more boring conventions of film-making. And it was always fun & we were always in practice. A 15 minute short could be finished in 2 hrs (plus another 2 hrs for the dual-VCR editing). I guess I just got lucky with that group of friends, maybe...
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Yeah, I get that. I wasn't talking about "amateur" status.

I was part of a stable of musicians with a record company in the late 70's / early 80's. One of their artists would come up with an idea, I would get a call and be at his place an hour later with one or two other guys. Three hours later we would be tracking in a 16 or 24 track studio (anyone remember 2" reel-to-reel?) and be laying down, tracks, one, two or even three songs. Sometimes a few days later I would get called in for overdubs and/or BG vox, and occasionally after that to fly second chair for mixdown. These are songs that wound up on albums (anyone remember vinyl?) and I would hear them on the radio within weeks or months.

Ahhhhhh, those were the days...
 
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Atlanta is bursting with indie filmmakers. Some good, some trying hard, some posing, but there's alot of good stuff going on, and it doesn't take long to learn who you want to work with, and who you don't. Typically, it's the ones who are doing really good work who throw you the bones of paying gigs. One in particular has consistantly hired me for his commercial work, and in return, when he's working his own projects, all he has to do is call, and if I'm not already booked, I'll block out a weekend or two for him.
 
portland Oregon is pretty hopping.. there are few bigish TV shows and I've been to a couple of indie meet ups.. seems like lots of people, they all seem to know each other..
 
miketv said:
Sonnyboo....your name has been familiar to me for a long time now. I'm originally from SW Ohio (Dayton/Cincy area).By the persistence of your name's presence alone, I'm inclined to believe that you are another serious local filmmaker. You're about 3 hrs from me now....could I maybe I could sit in on a meeting sometime? I'd like to see what sort of "thing" you have going on....maybe I can pick your brain to form my own group up here....
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Check out www.midohiofilm.com for when meetings are, especially on Facebook. It's kind of a haul and I'm sure there are similar groups of real filmmakers in Detroit. At least one moderator on here is from Detroit and can give guidance.
 
Alcove Audio said:
It all depends on what you call a "scene". In the music biz - and I was involved for almost 30 years - is as you described. But you're out every night either playing or checking out other bands (while partying and looking to get laid).

You can sit at home by yourself and watch a film - maybe one or two like-minded friends will join you - and you have to actually pay attention.

You can't just jump into a film crew and "jam" or whip out a new movie in a couple of hours the way you can run into a studio and lay down some tracks.

And a lot of filmmaking needs to be solitary, or at least executed in a relatively calm environment like reading and writing scripts, preproduction, etc.

The whole culture is entirely different. DPs aren't as interested in heading off to a club to show off their new ink as a guitarist. Not many grips can learn three cords and join a film crew 'cause it's cool and they'll meet girls. Directors don't stand on the front of the stage and get panties thrown at them.

The film "scene" is when you head out to meet-and-greets once or twice a month and network, looking for actors and crew members, and commiserating with other fill in the blank (DPs, sound guys, writers, gaffers, etc.) and when you go to screenings, or work on your own or others projects
Click to expand...


great answer
 
Yeah, I think Alcove's explanation makes a lot of sense. Sure, you can "jam" as a filmmaker, and make a movie in just a couple hours. But that's not really the norm; there's no question that music is a much more spontaneous art-form.

It's difficult for me to believe that you haven't met any serious filmmakers in Detroit, for as long as a time-span as you've been doing this. To be honest, for you to say that makes me think you're not trying to meet people, not even slightly. Perhaps it's different from music, in that you kind of have to actively seek other filmmakers out, instead of just naturally running into them, the way that you might in the musical-world.

Others have mentioned the 48HFP. Besides the networking opportunities it provides, it's also just a heck of a lot of fun. But there are other ways to meet filmmakers.

I'm quite sure that Michigan would have some kind of association for filmmakers. Virginia, for example, has the Virginia Production Alliance), and they have regular meet-ups and host different events. And that's just in lil'-ole Richmond. Surely, there must be something like that in Detroit.

I've met most of my filmmaking-friends, though, through good ol'-fashioned personal networks. A friend of mine was in a band, and they made a music video. I told him I liked the video, and asked if he'd introduce me to the filmmaker. I've since volunteered to work on his projects, and he has also helped on mine. And all the filmmakers he knew, I am now also acquainted with (and sometimes work with). And then I meet other people through those people. But it doesn't happen on it's own -- you have to actively seek people out.
 
Nigeria. That's where the film scene is.

I just watched part of a documentary called Nollywood Babylon. Apparently Nigeria is where people are whipping out movies & selling them for money -to audiences- with no traditional Hollywood-style intervention. The main subject of the film is a director who had made & sold 158 movies.

Granted, there are a lot of meaningful differences in our market systems & cultures.
+ For one thing, it's a lot more dangerous to go out of the house in Nigeria than it is in Detroit, so people don't really go to movie theaters. And Hollywood doesn't mean much to Nigerians, so there's no real market for big-budget stars & effects & pomp there.
+ Watching a movie there is a personal experience, usually shared with someone else with the intent of communicating an idea for discussion. Someone sees a movie, feels something, & shares it with a friend.(Very rock & roll.)
+ Combine that with the ramshackle state of technology in Nigeria limiting the amount of piracy that goes on, and the DIY dvd market is slamming.

It made me wonder about a lot of new things. We have a completely supersaturated video market. Everybody & his dog has a youtube channel. Millions of people are giving away quality spontaneous entertainment for free, and millions of viewers are getting the product.....while we, on the other hand, actually invest our own money & time into projects that we're lucky to have viewed by hundreds & remembered by few. Why is that?

It feels like independent filmmaking came to a crossroads at the turn of the millennium. It could have slowly eroded Hollywood the way the indie music scene slowly eroded the Music Industry, but it didn't. Instead, it somehow became Hollywood. It became more exclusive, instead of inclusive. Big stars are making big money in the indies now, with huge distro deals & all the pomp & politics of regular Hollywood. Budgets are fluffed ridiculously high for no reason. I fail to see the difference between the major & indie systems any more. Is this just a bitter pill of the free market & my choice to be a filmmaker?

As far as the 48 Hr competition, it's just never worked out for me. Every time it comes around I look for a crew to join, but nobody even responds to my posts or emails. I think my sense of humor might be a bit off-putting for some people. And I don't know many local people at all (much less any local rough-&-ready filmmakers who will pay their share of an entry fee), so I can't start my own crew. I'd animate something/do a solo project, but I've only got 48 hrs & no time to prepare. It sounds great, but amazingly, it's just not part of my reality.

At the same time, I'm not sure the 48hr competition is what I'm looking for. It's just kinda what everyone is doing, & I'm not really sure what it's worth. I mean, you win....a trophy. And your movie gets shown to a bunch of other filmmakers. And the next day at work your boss says he doesn't care if your movie won the damn Palme D'or, you gotta get that grease trap cleaned before the lunch rush. The remains of the independent film scene seems to be nothing more than non-paying festivals.....intellectually rewarding, but ultimately it's just a way for about 3 people with access to a venue to make some money off struggling artists.

I know this is a lot of rambling....I've got a lot on my mind about this stuff lately....just venting & fishing.....like i said, I don't know many filmmakers. Maybe someone out there's got something new to say.
 
About the 48hfp, maybe you should look at it the other way around. Don't try to start a crew. Try to JOIN a crew. The people who do it are the people you're looking to meet. They're the ones who want to front cash for a fee, get together for a weekend and make a film. These are the people you don't know yet.

It's not about the trophy, and it's not about getting your work seen. It's about meeting people, it's about honing your skills, and having fun.

Find a list of last year's teams in your area. Find them on youtube or facebook or wherever. Drop them a line saying "hey, I dug your film last year. Are you doing it again this year? I'd love to be involved; can I join your team?"

Here in Pittsburgh there's a "meet and greet" and a "post-party" after the final screening. Go to them (bring business cards). Talk to everyone you can. Find out who they are and what they do. Let them know the same about you and give them a card.

Oh, and basic networking here, but be interested in their work, not just trying to sell your own.

As you say, it's what lots of people are doing...but exactly the people who you currently don't know, but would like to know. Yes, the competition is kinda pointless. The films themselves are usually, well, done in a weekend rather than good. But it's a good "in" to your local scene.

I've done it the past three years (as a composer, which is an interesting challenge!) and always have a great time. Each year I meet new people and improve my skills. I can't recommend the experience enough!

Addendum: Urgh, I feel like a dick now. Just re-read your post where you said you tried joining crews, but with no luck. That said, just because you haven't found yourself a team doesn't mean you can't go to the meet-and-greets. Do the same thing; talk to the people there, find out what they do. That's MUCH easier to do in person than through a random, unsolicited e-mail.
 
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Most of our strong connections we've made over the years have come from the 48hr and other competitions like that.
 
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Well, back to the original question -- yes, local filmmaking scenes do exist, you've just chosen not to take part in them. And now I'm gonna say something that is potentially A-hole-y of me, but I don't intend it to be.

Basic social skills are very necessary for filmmaking. This is a collaborative art. You gotta be able to reach out to other people, find common interests, find people who want to work with you. You simply have to be sociable in order to make this thing work.

That is a large part of what the 48HFP is about. It's a group event, and there are tons of people to meet. It's also a crash-course on how to make a movie under tight time-constraints. Bottom-line, it's just plain fun. The awards don't mean anything. And your boss will be more than understanding (they'll probably want to attend the screening).
 
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