where to go now

D

derek smith

Just found out today, the Executive Producer that was getting me funding for my Project, is a con man. Turns out, he has conned close to 40 people out of money by promising them he'll get funding due to his contact etc, but comes to nothing
Wasted a good 6months not looking elsewere for potential investment or Producer to take my Project on, as I was instructed by this guy I was contracted to his team. Feeling pretty crap, but goinna stay positive...Moving forward, whats my best option. I have my Screenplay, so do I make contact with some actual Producers to see if they want to take my Project on, or get a Manager to try source a Producer to take my Project on???

Any feedback, greatly appreciated, as feeling a bit lost....but every experience a learning one
 
Sort by date Sort by votes
derek smith said:
Just found out today, the Executive Producer that was getting me funding for my Project, is a con man. Turns out, he has conned close to 40 people out of money by promising them he'll get funding due to his contact etc, but comes to nothing
Wasted a good 6months not looking elsewere for potential investment or Producer to take my Project on, as I was instructed by this guy I was contracted to his team. Feeling pretty crap, but goinna stay positive...Moving forward, whats my best option. I have my Screenplay, so do I make contact with some actual Producers to see if they want to take my Project on, or get a Manager to try source a Producer to take my Project on???

Any feedback, greatly appreciated, as feeling a bit lost....but every experience a learning one
Click to expand...

Would you be open to producing the film yourself?
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
WalterB said:
Have you ever made a video? A short?
That experience can really help you gaining more insight in producing yourself.
Click to expand...

producing a short film towards end of april, which I will be directing too....will be self funded...although funding a feature is goinna be a big ask....not really sure how to started
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Your first step would be working what you have to work with (favors owed, equipment access), what you need, the gap between the two and how much it'll cost to fill that gap.

That process will help you determine whether your project is within your means.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Sweetie said:
Your first step would be working what you have to work with (favors owed, equipment access), what you need, the gap between the two and how much it'll cost to fill that gap.

That process will help you determine whether your project is within your means.
Click to expand...

thanks sweetie....I did previously looked at putting together a business plan, but when it comes to stats etc, im hopeless...can you hire someone who would complete a Business PLan for you???
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
derek smith said:
open to all possibilities.....any tips on producing it myself.....appreciate any advice
Click to expand...

I think, rather then getting bogged down trying to find a new producer, you should put this project on the backburner, concentrate on this next project of yours coming up and give that your attention.

After that, come back to your current project, read through it again to see if you can cut costs anywhere and have a go at producing it yourself.

Or as others have said, do some very low budget shorts first. This will help you learn how to handle filming your own projects.

You will be fine. Just keep your momentum going and come back to this delayed project later when you are ready to put that into action.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
derek smith said:
thanks sweetie....I did previously looked at putting together a business plan, but when it comes to stats etc, im hopeless...can you hire someone who would complete a Business PLan for you???
Click to expand...

You don't need to be a chartered accountant to do a business plan.

It can be as simple as this....


Camera: Panasonic GH2 + glass. $1000
Lighting: Home made kit: $200
Battery Pack for lighting: $200
Audio: Borrowing audio gear off friend
Editing rig: already own
Props needed
-jacket and top hat $60 or $13 a day if I rent.
-Shovel. Already owned
etc etc etc etc etc

Total $***.**

Safe money, ie dollars left over in case costs come up. $2000

You will find the costs by going through each scene of your movie and thinking about the realities of actually filming that scene. Most indie writers at the early stage will write their films based around cheap of free scenes that won't break the bank to film. If your costs seem too high, maybe go back and see what things you can change or trim to bring the cost down scene by scene.

Out of your safe money, expect to lose a few dollars each day on things like hot chips to keep your crew well fed and motivated. It's those little things like a good lunch or dinner that keep them happy and show them you don't think of them as slaves on your film project.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
FantasyFilmProductions said:
You don't need to be a chartered accountant to do a business plan.

It can be as simple as this....


Camera: Panasonic GH2 + glass. $1000
Lighting: Home made kit: $200
Battery Pack for lighting: $200
Audio: Borrowing audio gear off friend
Editing rig: already own
Props needed
-jacket and top hat $60 or $13 a day if I rent.
-Shovel. Already owned
etc etc etc etc etc

Total $***.**

Safe money, ie dollars left over in case costs come up. $2000

You will find the costs by going through each scene of your movie and thinking about the realities of actually filming that scene. Most indie writers at the early stage will write their films based around cheap of free scenes that won't break the bank to film. If your costs seem too high, maybe go back and see what things you can change or trim to bring the cost down scene by scene.

Out of your safe money, expect to lose a few dollars each day on things like hot chips to keep your crew well fed and motivated. It's those little things like a good lunch or dinner that keep them happy and show them you don't think of them as slaves on your film project.
Click to expand...

great advice thanks.....Put a cast / crew call out yesterday for my short, and its already gathering pace...I've had a look through my Feature Film Script and made notes of areas I can re-write to keep costs down....got a 2nd short goinna produce straight after my first one next month...so feeling pretty determined

I previously put a spreadsheet together of costs for the feature film...my only issue when it came to the business plan, was projecting potential revenues etc...other issue I have, is near all of the film boards etc that provide funding, require a 'known and respected' producer to be on board...so that's why im thinking ill need to go down that route
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
OP, sorry to hear of your predicament. To be honest, from some of your prior posts, I can't say I'm entirely gob-smacked. Commercial funding for a first-time director is very unusual and even then, the Exec Producer would ensure the director was surrounded by a very experienced management/logistics team. Some of the questions I noticed you asking would have been questions far better answered by one of those people rather than on an internet forum and is what made your situation appear a little strange.

Where do you go from here? Obviously finding another producer would be your best option but very few commercial producers would consider an inexperienced director/filmmaker because of the unlikelihood of them actually ending up with a commercial product. A possible exception would be a script which provides a realistic and exceptional potential for profit. If you honestly believe your script has such qualities then it would be worth investing the time in trying to find an amenable producer. If not, then self-funding and producing is your most realistic option and the advice of shelving your feature until you have acquired more knowledge/experience is probably wise.

FantasyFilmProductions said:
It can be as simple as this....
Click to expand...

Err, that's not a business plan, that's a list of costs/expenditure. A business plan would include the costs and in addition contain both a "plan" to fund those costs and a "plan" to recoup that funding and make a profit, in order to make raising that funding a viable proposition to potential investors and make the "business" itself viable.

BTW, catering/craft services is not usually accounted for out of contingency funds, it's usually a listed expenditure (a specific production cost line item).

G
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
AudioPostExpert said:
OP, sorry to hear of your predicament. To be honest, from some of your prior posts, I can't say I'm entirely gob-smacked. Commercial funding for a first-time director is very unusual and even then, the Exec Producer would ensure the director was surrounded by a very experienced management/logistics team. Some of the questions I noticed you asking would have been questions far better answered by one of those people rather than on an internet forum and is what made your situation appear a little strange.

Where do you go from here? Obviously finding another producer would be your best option but very few commercial producers would consider an inexperienced director/filmmaker because of the unlikelihood of them actually ending up with a commercial product. A possible exception would be a script which provides a realistic and exceptional potential for profit. If you honestly believe your script has such qualities then it would be worth investing the time in trying to find an amenable producer. If not, then self-funding and producing is your most realistic option and the advice of shelving your feature until you have acquired more knowledge/experience is probably wise.



Err, that's not a business plan, that's a list of costs/expenditure. A business plan would include the costs and in addition contain both a "plan" to fund those costs and a "plan" to recoup that funding and make a profit, in order to make raising that funding a viable proposition to potential investors and make the "business" itself viable.

BTW, catering/craft services is not usually accounted for out of contingency funds, it's usually a listed expenditure (a specific production cost line item).

G
Click to expand...

that's for the reassurance....funny enough I said to my housemate on Tuesday that things where progressing too smoothly...and then Friday, found out about the Producer being a con man...at the time, I seen this guy was actively attached to several films in production that have respected crew / cast attached and no one had an issue with him...one of the films he ripped off, was a true story about a woman who over came a lot of abuse in her life...the fact he ripped this woman off with her past, is incredibly low....I can blame lack of experience in the industry and will obviously learn form it....I worked with a script consultant (very respected one in Ireland), and he commented that my script had a lot of commercial appeal, due to the storyline...I need to get my script solicited as most of the production companies wont read your script otherwise.....guessing the best way for this, is to sign up with a literacy agency???
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
I did previously looked at putting together a business plan, but when it comes to stats etc, im hopeless...can you hire someone who would complete a Business PLan for you???
Click to expand...

There are. They're called Producers.

Be wary though. If you pay a producer to write up your business plan, you may find yourself with a useless document without the producer working with you.

I previously put a spreadsheet together of costs for the feature film...my only issue when it came to the business plan, was projecting potential revenues etc...other issue I have, is near all of the film boards etc that provide funding, require a 'known and respected' producer to be on board...so that's why im thinking ill need to go down that route
Click to expand...

Don't take this the wrong way. The last thing I want to do is insult you, though it's probably going to come across that way. I'm also assuming you're the director on your project:

You're your own biggest problem to getting any kind of meaningful financing. When I say you, I mean you, the unestablished director (any unestablished director).

On a project, the director has a lot of power. It's the directors vision that the team are following.

When you're talking producer who's going to obtain financing, the producer is the one that is most responsible for the films success or failure. It's their career on the line. Their job is to get the best team possible for the budget that makes sense for the film.

A first time director getting a producer to put all the pieces together (called a package) to obtain financing is a really special circumstance. The difference in budget between having you direct and having the next up and comer (the director who has already finished his first film and his first hit - Think Chris Nolan after Momento) isn't that much. On top of that, the up and comer is in a position to be more likely to attract the talent needed to get the financing.

It's the whole chicken and the egg problem.

Now if you had released something that got some buzz going that you're potentially the next up and comer that can be a game changer. Alternatively if you have something in your pocket that changes your bargaining position (a killer script that producers are going nuts over like Rocky, or access to higher end marketable talent), that puts you in another ball park.

This is why it's common for directors to take 4 to 5 figures out of their own pocket and make their first feature film to get the ball rolling.

Now this is an exceptionally simplistic view of the whole process. I'm also talking a decent budgeted film. I'm not talking films that get shot for 7k, 10k, even 25k etc.

Err, that's not a business plan
Click to expand...

On this, I'll have to agree with Ape. It's part of a films business plan, though it's probably the least important part.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
That does sound particularly sleazy, unfortunately there are some particularly sleazy people out there. On the other side of the coin, there are also some particularly nice people out there too.

derek smith said:
I worked with a script consultant (very respected one in Ireland), and he commented that my script had a lot of commercial appeal, due to the storyline...
Click to expand...

That may or may not be especially relevant. A script may have the potential to attract a wide (paying) audience, which is obviously commercially appealing. On the other hand, to attract a wide audience in practice is likely to require relatively high production costs, so then it's a question of likely profit margins rather than just purely about the amount of commercial appeal. In other words, commercial indie producers and their investors are ideally looking for a script with both high commercial appeal AND low production costs. However, this is quite a bit of an oversimplification of what is a fairly complex determination.

Sorry, although I've picked up enough over the years to have a good understanding of the general principles, I don't feel knowledgeable enough in the specifics to advise you on the best route to solicit your script.

G
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
AudioPostExpert said:
Err, that's not a business plan, that's a list of costs/expenditure. A business plan would include the costs and in addition contain both a "plan" to fund those costs and a "plan" to recoup that funding and make a profit, in order to make raising that funding a viable proposition to potential investors and make the "business" itself viable.

BTW, catering/craft services is not usually accounted for out of contingency funds, it's usually a listed expenditure (a specific production cost line item).

G
Click to expand...

Thanks for the point on catering.

I assumed (perhaps mistakenly) that most indie films don't make profit...I certainly don't.
And I assumed that funding would come from the producers own pocket (again perhaps mistakenly) as
his attempt to find funding elsewhere had fallen over.

Effectively I was looking at the Plan B of him producing it himself. Funding it himself, and effectively trying to
distribute it himself.

Perhaps that was naive of me.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
FantasyFilmProductions said:
I assumed (perhaps mistakenly) that most indie films don't make profit.
Click to expand...

They don't! The reason they don't is that either: 1. Most hobbyist/amateur filmmakers do not make films for profit in the first place, they make them for the learning experience, for the sense of accomplishment, just for the fun of it or most likely a combination of all three or 2. In the case of commercially oriented filmmakers, they were unable to realize their plan to make a profit. Most commonly because their projections and their "plan" to achieve them were not realistic.

The type 1 filmmaker does not need a business plan, they just need to keep track of their expenses/costs so they don't exceed the resources they have available to make their film. The self-funded/made/distributed type 2 filmmaker also does not specifically need a business plan, although it would be wise to make one as they generally have a higher number of expenses/costs to consider (marketing and distribution for example) and of course should have a plan for making a profit, rather than just trusting to luck. It's only really the type 2 filmmaker seeking external funding or investment who would specifically need an actual business plan document.

Regardless of whether a filmmaker requires an actual business plan or not, what you posted was just a list of possible expenses, not really a plan and certainly not a "business plan".

G
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Sweetie said:
There are. They're called Producers.

Be wary though. If you pay a producer to write up your business plan, you may find yourself with a useless document without the producer working with you.



Don't take this the wrong way. The last thing I want to do is insult you, though it's probably going to come across that way. I'm also assuming you're the director on your project:

You're your own biggest problem to getting any kind of meaningful financing. When I say you, I mean you, the unestablished director (any unestablished director).

On a project, the director has a lot of power. It's the directors vision that the team are following.

When you're talking producer who's going to obtain financing, the producer is the one that is most responsible for the films success or failure. It's their career on the line. Their job is to get the best team possible for the budget that makes sense for the film.

A first time director getting a producer to put all the pieces together (called a package) to obtain financing is a really special circumstance. The difference in budget between having you direct and having the next up and comer (the director who has already finished his first film and his first hit - Think Chris Nolan after Momento) isn't that much. On top of that, the up and comer is in a position to be more likely to attract the talent needed to get the financing.

It's the whole chicken and the egg problem.

Now if you had released something that got some buzz going that you're potentially the next up and comer that can be a game changer. Alternatively if you have something in your pocket that changes your bargaining position (a killer script that producers are going nuts over like Rocky, or access to higher end marketable talent), that puts you in another ball park.

This is why it's common for directors to take 4 to 5 figures out of their own pocket and make their first feature film to get the ball rolling.

Now this is an exceptionally simplistic view of the whole process. I'm also talking a decent budgeted film. I'm not talking films that get shot for 7k, 10k, even 25k etc.



On this, I'll have to agree with Ape. It's part of a films business plan, though it's probably the least important part.
Click to expand...

in no way do I take that as an insult, really appreciate the constructive criticisms....Absolutly agree about my lack of experience....Im a Manager at the Company I work at, and I wouldn't take anyone on, if they didn't have a track record or something that made them stand out.....My problem is not having anyone I know personally work in the Industry, so im learning through advice of forums, and mainly from making mistakes.....I have my first Short Film Crew all in place, with auditions happening at end of month, so starting the ball rolling....Goinna concentrate on getting few shorts completed for a show reel and to hone my skill before I source a Producer....got confidence in my ideas and screenplays...whether that takes me far remains to be seen.....when my ex producer came on board, and like the toehrs ive spoke to who he 'conned', he mad eme think my screenplay was going to be big...he's in the national paper, well was yesterday regarding being investigated.....Onwards and upwards

Ive been reading a book, cant mind of top of my head by who, but its the 'bible' in terms of putting a business plan together....it was recommended by someone on here....so hoping to start putting something together
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
What I found really helps is a combination of real world experience and book/video/course learning.

I'd start off watching a bunch of youtube videos and if you can afford it, some courses in the areas that you think you may have an interest in. Also pay some attention to other department heads and learn what they do.

Then I'd jump in and learn from other peoples shoots as much as I can. Try out some of your experience on your own film or two and see how you go. Then jump on to some other productions. Try another production and then sit down again and study in the areas where you feel it fell down or just could do with some more learning.

At that point, you decide what you need. More experience, more training or if you're just ready to jump in and become the next big thing.

All that being said, everyone is different. You may find another path more suited to who you are.

Keep on asking questions.

Good luck.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top