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Old 02-02-2017, 05:52 AM   #1
harmonica44
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10 db pad vs rycote softie.

For my mic the AT4053b, I have trouble recording certain sounds with percussion, where slight wind pressure is a factor. I asked around, and one person told me I needed a 10 db pad, but I thought that the rycote softie, or some other kind of wind protection would be better. Plus I don't know if a 10 db pad would be the right choice for the task.

What do you think?

Last edited by harmonica44; 02-02-2017 at 05:54 AM.
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Old 02-02-2017, 02:56 PM   #2
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Your post is so incredibly vague that I have no idea what you are trying to record or the circumstances under which the sounds are being recorded. "Certain sounds with percussion" - what the fornication does that mean? Drums? Weapons? Vocal plosives? Pots and pans on a stove? Knocking on your wooden head?

And what kind of trouble? Distortion? Unwanted sounds being picked up during recording? Weird harmonics?


PADs control input levels.

SOFTIEs control wind (somewhat).


Maybe you should just check your mic placement, or try a different mic, like a dynamic.



As always you are looking for answers that cannot be given. You have to make decisions based upon your knowledge and experience. You have obviously retained nothing of the thousands upon thousands of words I have directed specifically at you over the last several years. All the information you need is there and in the books, tutorials and films to which I have directed you.
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Old 02-03-2017, 03:42 AM   #3
harmonica44
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Sorry for the lack of detail. Noises like car doors slamming form the inside of a car. When the sound hits the 4053b, it sounds like the sound you get when wind goes into the mic. I thought about getting a wind protection device, but then someone told me that a 10 db pad is better for that intead.

I already have a blimp for wind protection, but would probably like something else for the 4053b, since the blimp is big and bulky. Would a 10 db pad, be the tool for the job? As for placement, I tried pointing it diagonal from the car door, from above, but it still picks up wind, and is very sensitive. It's either wind, or it does not like percussion sounds.
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Old 02-03-2017, 03:47 AM   #4
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Shot in the dark here- have you checked connections, wires etc? also with the placement I've noticed even with a spit-screen(no clue what it's actually called) Loud "tangy" sounds cause an undesirable static. I use a MV-1 camera to record death metal shows, I typically stand off to the side of the pit next to the speakers, it does well with that loud sound unless I move, then for a moment there's some off static/interferance I know isn't from touching the camera or anything. what I'm getting to - is the mic moving?

PS. I have damned near no clue when it comes to audio devices, just trying to jog some solutions for ya!

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Old 02-03-2017, 05:20 AM   #5
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Maybe what you're hearing is the door's rubber? Maybe pull the mic back and go from there?
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Old 02-03-2017, 05:31 AM   #6
harmonica44
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No I don't think it's the rubber. I also tried on some other door's in my house to compare, and it's the same thing. I think it's just the wind from the swing. I can move the mic back but the more I do that, the more it changes the perspective in the sound, and if a door is slamming close up on camera, then you want it to sound close up in the mic, and not further away of course.

So is there a way to record sounds with a wind swing, where I cannot stand too far back? I probably just need wind protection, or 10 db pad, or what? But standing back changes perspective, and is not the best solution it seems. I tried curving the mic so that the wind doesn't go in, but it still goes in and it's very sensitive. I tried it with a shockmount too, and it's still there.
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Old 02-03-2017, 12:26 PM   #7
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So if it's wind that's causing the unwanted sound you use:

A) A softie or blimp that provides wind protection

OR

B) A pad which will reduce the volume of the signal going into the recorder but will have no affect upon the wind





BTW, if you are recording dialog the car door doesn't mean a thing; it's going to be replaced in audio post anyway. If you are recording sound effects you may need to use a different tool set and most definitely adopt a different mind set.

Last edited by Alcove Audio; 02-03-2017 at 01:05 PM.
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Old 02-03-2017, 01:34 PM   #8
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Okay thanks. I am just guessing it's the wind, but one person told me it may be the percussion and to get the 10db pad. I will get a softie and see if that works first. As for recording sound effects with different tools, should I use a different mic?

The reason why I wanted to use the same mic as dialogue, is so it all sounds like it's the same movie, and then I won't to get one mic to sound like the other, so much.

As for replacing dialogue in the car in post, I would still use the same mic, to get it to all sound the same, right?
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Old 02-03-2017, 03:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harmonica44 View Post
I am just guessing it's the wind, but one person told me it may be the percussion and to get the 10db pad.

Guessing? GUESSING???!!! You have to KNOW!!! You have to determine which one it is, THEN you can embark upon a solution. It may be as simple as positioning the mic further away or changing the angle so the mic is less affected by the air motion. If you're overloading the mic diaphragm a 10db pad will do nothing for you as it is placed in then signal path AFTER the mic. If you are overloading the pre-amp then turn the frikking gain down.

BTW, are you sure that you are just not hearing the proximity effect? Maybe all you need to do is roll off some low end. Remember that mics do not hear the way your ears do, your recorder does not process the way your brain does, and any form of reproduction/playback is completely artificial (as is the entire filmmaking process). What you are recording is merely raw data for future manipulation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harmonica44 View Post
As for recording sound effects with different tools, should I use a different mic?
Quote:
Originally Posted by harmonica44 View Post
The reason why I wanted to use the same mic as dialogue, is so it all sounds like it's the same movie, and then I won't to get one mic to sound like the other, so much.
I routinely use several different mics to record sound effects; you use the mic(s) that is (are) proper for the sound(s) being recorded. I've used multiple mics simultaeously to record the same sound. Getting all of the sounds to fit together is what rerecording/mixing is all about.
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Old 02-03-2017, 04:16 PM   #10
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Okay thanks. The problem with repositioning the mic, is that I have to place it too far away, and the perspective won't match. It will sound too far away, compared to the video. Also, the sound comes up to -12 decibels, so the settings are not too high.

Basically it just sounds static-ish, compared to recording other sounds. Why is it that percussion sounds, such as door slammings, sound static-ish with this mic. When I determine that, then I can determine what the problem is.
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Old 02-03-2017, 06:16 PM   #11
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How wide are you swinging the door? If all you want is the sound of it shutting then all you'd need is a few inches to close.
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Old 02-03-2017, 06:29 PM   #12
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or if it's suction open the windows a tad...
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Old 02-03-2017, 06:34 PM   #13
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Please post an image of the wave form and a video ofthe sound.
That is the only way to create context.
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:01 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harmonica44 View Post
Basically it just sounds static-ish, compared to recording other sounds. Why is it that percussion sounds, such as door slammings, sound static-ish with this mic. When I determine that, then I can determine what the problem is.
Without being able to hear the result of your unexplained recording process it seems like, from what you are describing, you're blowing out the mic diaphragm.

Now, since you don't think like a sound guy, here's a few things you might consider:

Opening all the doors and windows of the vehicle. This will cut down on the air compression inside the vehicle.

Try several different mic positions, including laying the seat(s) flat so you can position the mic off-axis.

Use a dynamic mic (3rd recommendation in this thread alone).



BTW, I've recorded vehicle door, hood and trunk slams (and many other vehicle sounds) from multiple perspectives with large diaphragm mics, which are MUCH more sensitive to wind and transients than your AT4053b. With proper mic placement, proper protection and proper pre-amp/recorder settings I have gotten many wonderful recordings.


You really need to think all this over. Consider yourself alone in the wilderness without any hope of rescue; if you can't survive the trip, don't take the journey. You do not to retain information, you refuse to go back to information previously given to you (perhaps don't even remember that you've been given this information many times previously), and even refuse to do your own trouble-shooting, instead asking vague questions about vague circumstances expecting explicit solutions.

Being an artist, or even a technical artist such as a PSM/Boom-Op or audio post engineer, requires you to think independently, to do and retain the results of lots of study & experimentation, to rely on your previously acquired skill-set & experience, to do it creatively and to do it FAST.


As I have mentioned in the past, you don't THINK like a soundie. Maybe it's because you don't listen……….
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Old 02-03-2017, 07:53 PM   #15
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Once again you don't even know what the problem is but you are asking for solutions. Post the audio or move on, this wastes valuable time here. This is the equivalent of:

"Hey guys my Mustang makes a weird sound, what can I do to fix it?"

It's not fair, you need to tell us the issue, not have us guess and offer solutions to something that may not even exist!
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