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Old 11-15-2017, 04:54 AM   #1
McCloud
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breaking the 180 rule in a small room ?

So I've got the following office scene..



I'd need to do an establishing shot from the door on the whole office, then medium / detail on the person sitting behind the desk, his coffee mug.
Then a wide shot from the window side showing another person coming in.

Then again a close up on the face of the guy sitting behind the table.


Would this look ok ?
When it's drawn like this, it seems all over the place.. but I can't think of any other way to do this.. and it shouldn't look that bad if I combine the actual shots in post.
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Old 11-15-2017, 05:27 AM   #2
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Is that two cameras? Any reason you need to shoot with two? Are they your camera positions?

If you cross the line, both people will be looking in the same direction, so they won't look like they're looking at each other at all. As far as I can tell, there appears to be no need to cross the line in this scene, but I don't know what the action will be.
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Old 11-15-2017, 06:40 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jax_rox View Post
Is that two cameras? Any reason you need to shoot with two? Are they your camera positions?

If you cross the line, both people will be looking in the same direction, so they won't look like they're looking at each other at all. As far as I can tell, there appears to be no need to cross the line in this scene, but I don't know what the action will be.
sorry, my bad.
One camera... it just shows the change of positions.

Basically, from the C1 position, person 1 will be seen from the back.

But I also need to get a detail of his face.. from the front (position C2).

Is there a better way to do this ?
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Old 11-15-2017, 07:42 AM   #4
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Are you trying to say that the room is so small that you can't use the 180-degree rule?
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Old 11-15-2017, 11:13 AM   #5
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Just make sure the eyelines are correct and it will be okay.
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Old 11-15-2017, 01:06 PM   #6
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Technically you can't break the 180-degree rule with one person, per-say, if it is a rule breaker than it is an acceptable one often called a flip. Once the second person enters the room, it becomes possible if you start moving the camera from either side of the two actors. No reason to do that since you can use other shots that will work as well.
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Old 11-15-2017, 01:10 PM   #7
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Technically you can't break the 180-degree rule with one person, per-say,
Of course you can. Actor is walking down the street, screen left to right. Cut to: he is walking down the street screen right to left. But is supposed to be still walking in the same direction.

The main reason for the 180 rule is orientation.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:05 PM   #8
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Okay, if moving it can happen as you say. Why anyone would shoot that is beyond me, however, depending on the shot, it might still work and not confuse the viewer. Close-up with various angles perhaps.

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Of course you can. Actor is walking down the street, screen left to right. Cut to: he is walking down the street screen right to left. But is supposed to be still walking in the same direction.

The main reason for the 180 rule is orientation.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:11 PM   #9
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It happens more times than you would think.

If you do break the plane, a test screening if often a good idea, to see if anyone was disoriented.

"I don't understand why the burglar was running back to the store he just robbed."

Time for a re-edit.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:25 PM   #10
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A good storyboard can usually prevent these mishaps.

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It happens more times than you would think.

If you do break the plane, a test screening if often a good idea, to see if anyone was disoriented.

"I don't understand why the burglar was running back to the store he just robbed."

Time for a re-edit.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:49 PM   #11
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What you call a mishap others would call intentional. There's times people want to break it, and a test screening helps see if it works.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:54 PM   #12
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Just make sure the eyelines are correct and it will be okay.
Agreed.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:56 PM   #13
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Very true!

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What you call a mishap others would call intentional. There's times people want to break it, and a test screening helps see if it works.
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Old 11-15-2017, 02:59 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Okay, if moving it can happen as you say. Why anyone would shoot that is beyond me, however,
Why is that beyond you? People who post here are at different
levels of experience. For me it took some experimentation and
mistakes to grasp screen direction.

On one of my very first films we shot a chase scene. At one point
we found a great angle and shot the people running. It wasn't
until the editing that I noticed that one shot made it look like they
had suddenly turned around. I actually made that mistake several
times as I was learning and building my level of experience.

I still sometimes struggle with the "180 degree rule". Less so
these days with moving but often with small rooms. What has helped
me is keeping track of the eyeline. Technically that rule CAN be broken
with one person; a master shot of them sitting at a desk where the
window is clearly to their right. A close up where they look to their
left to gaze out the window. For you it may be innate or it may be
because of your experience but to some filmmakers it isn't that
easy to keep track.
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Old 11-15-2017, 04:12 PM   #15
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The 180 degree rule is not a rule, it's a guideline for basic dialogue between two people. Hollywood movies break this rule all the time especially Marvel movies. As long as the audience can still figure out that one person still has eye contact with the other it's fine.
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