Home

Go Back   IndieTalk - Indie Film Forum > Making The Film > Celluloid

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-20-2016, 08:44 PM   #1
Preston Hashagen
Basic Member
 
Preston Hashagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Port Jervis, ny
Posts: 16
Camera?

I've been watching a lot of movies lately and following a lot of directors who love shooting on film and I also really love it's look. I've tried finding video cameras that shoot on film but can't seem to find any. I'm new to this but so far it just seems like bigger productions can pull it off. Are there any cameras for lower end film makers like myself to use? If so what type of film looks the most modern?

Thanks!
Preston Hashagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Today   #1A
film guy
Basic Member
 
Posts: 17

 
Old 04-20-2016, 09:21 PM   #2
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Hashagen View Post
I've been watching a lot of movies lately and following a lot of directors who love shooting on film and I also really love it's look. I've tried finding video cameras that shoot on film but can't seem to find any. I'm new to this but so far it just seems like bigger productions can pull it off. Are there any cameras for lower end film makers like myself to use? If so what type of film looks the most modern?

Thanks!
It's just semantics but it will help in your search: video cameras do not shoot
film. Since you tried to find video cameras that shoot film you came up empty.
What you are looking for is either super 8 film cameras or 16mm film cameras.
Use those search terms in Google and you'll find a lot of cameras for lower end
film makers like yourself to use.

For those of us who are older and started by shooting on film that was the ONLY
way for us to learn. But those who have never shot film will find the entire process
more challenging and demanding. I suggest you buy an inexpensive Canon (the
1014 is excellent), Nikon (the R8 is excellent) or Braun Nizo (the 148 is a fine one,
the S56 better) super 8 camera to start with. Shoot some film, process it, digitize
it and see if you can afford the entire process.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2016, 11:29 PM   #3
sfoster
IndieTalk Moderator
 
sfoster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 5,513
There are several streamlined cameras now where you can shoot on 8mm film and mail it off and get back a digital copy of what you shot.
sfoster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 12:08 AM   #4
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfoster View Post
There are several streamlined cameras now where you can shoot on 8mm film and mail it off and get back a digital copy of what you shot.
Which cameras are these?
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 12:43 AM   #5
sfoster
IndieTalk Moderator
 
sfoster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 5,513
Quote:
Originally Posted by directorik View Post
Which cameras are these?
Here is one... so at least one. Maybe there aren't multiple IDK.
And it's still not out yet o_0 heard about this thing a while ago.

http://www.kodak.com/ek/US/en/Consum...ra/default.htm

Processing the film should cost $50 to $75 a cartridge.

Last edited by sfoster; 04-21-2016 at 12:45 AM.
sfoster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 01:11 AM   #6
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfoster View Post
Here is one... so at least one. Maybe there aren't multiple IDK.
And it's still not out yet o_0 heard about this thing a while ago.

http://www.kodak.com/ek/US/en/Consum...ra/default.htm

Processing the film should cost $50 to $75 a cartridge.
I've been eagerly awaiting this camera. As you say it's not available yet,
so it seems a bit premature to offer it as an option to Prestion - especially
without offering a link. But now you have. And it's an interesting camera.
Certainly not "several" of them available, but this one may bridge the gap
between video cameras and film cameras.

You can get a super 8 cartridge processed and digitized right now without
waiting for this camera. Just shoot with any super 8 camera and send it to
any of the three labs already mentioned and get back a digital copy of what
you shot.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 02:44 AM   #7
sfoster
IndieTalk Moderator
 
sfoster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 5,513
yeah I saw that camera on the tonight show a while ago.
sfoster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 11:28 AM   #8
Preston Hashagen
Basic Member
 
Preston Hashagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Port Jervis, ny
Posts: 16
Excellent, which type of film is more preferred for the modern look? 8 or 16mm? And before I've looked up 8 and 16's but they mostly looked like still cameras or very old models that didn't seem to have interchangeable lenses. I've shot shorts on dslr but want to try the other route.
Preston Hashagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 12:02 PM   #9
Murdock
Basic - Premiere Expired
 
Murdock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 3,513
My guess, that's what it is, would be at least 35mm. I guess it would depend on the look you are going for. 8mm has a distinctive look, that I like, but I wouldn't call it "modern."

Side note: I really wish I could afford to do more with my 8mm cameras. I have a Canon 518 Auto Zoom, and a Canon 1014 Auto Zoom.

If, like me you get to the point you can't shoot with your camera/s, be sure to take out all the batteries so you don't get corrosion.
Murdock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 12:21 PM   #10
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Today's super 8 film stock is standard "modern" 35mm (the size "Hollywood"
uses) cut down to the right size for the cameras. You can purchase Kodak 7266
(a beautiful black and white stock) in super 8, 16mm and 35mm. You can buy
Kodak Vision3 (a fantastic color negative stock) in super 8, 16mm and 35mm.
16mm is larger than 8mm so it's closer in "look" to 35mm.

Yes, both super 8 and 16mm cameras you see are very old models. No
manufacturer makes these cameras any more; until that model Sean linked to.
There are several super 8 cameras that have interchangeable lenses; I own a
Beaulieu 5008 S and the Leicina Special. These are more expensive than the
ones I mentioned - pro level super 8. Most 16mm camera have lens mounts.
I own two vintage Bolex cameras, the classic Canon Scoopic and the workhorse
Eclair NPR, all with interchangeable lenses. If you want a "modern" 16mm camera
check out Arriflex - those are top of the line. Add a Ziess Prime set and you'll
get very close to the "modern" look you're asking about.

Look at the restored Beaulieu4008 that Pro8 is selling. Use Kodak Vision3 stock
and a 4K transfer...
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 03:46 PM   #11
Preston Hashagen
Basic Member
 
Preston Hashagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Port Jervis, ny
Posts: 16
Excellent, you guys have been very helpful. Do you have any suggestions for 16mm cameras to look into or would it be best to just try starting out with 8mm? And also a lot of test videos I can find on YouTube look very old school so is this due to the type of film used or just the camera?

Last edited by Preston Hashagen; 04-21-2016 at 04:06 PM.
Preston Hashagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 07:53 PM   #12
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Hashagen View Post
Excellent, you guys have been very helpful. Do you have any suggestions for 16mm cameras to look into or would it be best to just try starting out with 8mm?
Bolex cameras are solid; look at the RX5, the classic Canon Scoopic
and the workhorse Eclair NPR are good ones. If you want a "modern"
16mm camera check out Arriflex - those are top of the line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Hashagen View Post
And also a lot of test videos I can find on YouTube look very old school so is this due to the type of film used or just the camera?
You say you want the “type of film that looks the most modern” and
that looking at test videos on YouTube you only find an “old school”
look. How about a couple of examples. What looks “modern” to you?

I tend to think of modern movies as those shot digitally and then
manipulated and digitally color corrected. While those shot on film
seem “old school” to me. Even current movies shot on film are rarely
seen projected on film so what we see at home or even in theaters
is digitized and digitally color corrected.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2016, 08:43 PM   #13
Preston Hashagen
Basic Member
 
Preston Hashagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Port Jervis, ny
Posts: 16
What I'm looking for may be digitally corrected film which I still think has a unique look. For instance I think the hateful 8 looked amazing and I love Nolans films who is an avid film advocate. I also love the look of saving private Ryan which is very grainy and such. The 8mm footage tests I saw we're very grainy/noisy and had the lines and blotches which are something I don't want but, I also saw tests without that which is why I question if that is post or film quality. I'd like to color
Correct on my own and am also working on a western style script which would be cool to see a little more old school but is another reason I ask if that depends
On film type or camera.
Preston Hashagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 11:42 AM   #14
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Hashagen View Post
What I'm looking for may be digitally corrected film which I still think has a unique look. For instance I think the hateful 8 looked amazing
There is good news; "The Hateful Eight" was shot using Vision3 stock. The
same film stock you can get for a super 8 camera and a 16mm camera.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Preston Hashagen View Post
I'd like to color
Correct on my own and am also working on a western style script which would be cool to see a little more old school but is another reason I ask if that depends
On film type or camera.
Some of the look comes from the camera and the type of film. And the
smaller super 8 and 16mm cameras will have a different overall look than
35mm or the Ultra Panavision 65mm. The lenses used also matter - I know
you know that - as does the skill and experience of the filmmaker.

I wish there was a direct answer; pick this camera and this film and you'll
get the look you want. I suspect the difference in the tests you have seen
has more to do with the skill and experience of the photographer than the
camera or the type of film. Give Pfister or Richardson or Deakins a Beaulieu
and Vision3 and they can get some amazing images out of them.

Did you see “The Hateful eight” projected on film? Or only the digitized version?
The projected version was color timed the old fashioned way – photochemically
and looks quite different from the 35mm version or the version released digitally.

My advice is to pick up a film camera you can afford - you know have several
suggestions to choose from - buy some film and shoot some footage. Then process
and transfer and do the color correction you want to do. As I said in my first post,
I'm "old school" that's the way I learned - by doing it and making mistakes, so
that is usually my advice.

I envy you just starting this film journey. I loved every minute of it and I miss
shooting on film.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 02:47 PM   #15
Preston Hashagen
Basic Member
 
Preston Hashagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Port Jervis, ny
Posts: 16
I saw some other footage tests for the canon scoopic and they looked good while others had a lot of lines and blotches so I assume that came down to film type and such because a couple tests I saw looked wonderful. I'm only worried about not having a range to shoot with. I'd want some things to look crips and clean yet clearly on film while others such as the western I'm going to start writing out soon, to look more gritty and similar to the older Clint Eastwood style films but wouldn't want to have to own 5 different cameras lol. Also, I saw the hateful 8 on blue ray not projected sadly. I also looked up film prices and it was sort of hard to find, maybe because I did it on my phone and Kodak made me look through a catalog but am I correct in that 1 reel of 16mm is roughly $45? It said it was 50ft so how long would that last at 24fps?
Preston Hashagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
camera, film


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:20 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.


©IndieTalk