Notes on Producing

[2001 Productions]

I think you were more than fair and diplomatic with your sound person, considering you were misled to begin with. I always know going in that my crew doesn't know jack, so I'm ever vigilant to point out that the mic goes on the actor facing the camera.

On my most recent movie, I'd hired a professional makeup artist to create creatures for the scary scenes. She had to drive two hours to location, and when she arrived she informed me that she'd forgotten to bring along the prosthetic appliances for the actors' faces. To retrieve them required a four-hour round trip.

From the tone in her voice, I knew she fully expected me to explode in a rage. I must admit, I was a little shaken, but this was my third feature as producer/director so I'd withstood many such seeming disasters. It took only a quick glance at my storyboards for me to realize that, by the time she got the rest of their bodies made up and we shot all the stuff that didn't show their faces, her assistant would have returned with the appliances.

I told her, "Hey, don't stress about it. There's plenty to do in the meantime."

She was hugely relieved and busted her ass to do her best work. In the end, we didn't lose one second of shooting time due to the oversight. Plus, the actors were in much better spirits because they only had to wear the stifling facial appliances for half of the day.

To date, she has not billed me for that day's work, and it's been over four months.

When it comes to producing, the cool head prevails.

[Blade_Jones]

Find a good producer – and not some thief who wants to be in charge of the budget so he or she can siphon off 40% of your budget to subsidize their unjustifiably lavish lifestyle. That’s not happened to me yet, but even the big studio have plunderers just hoping someone is stupid enough to put them in charge of a huge escrow account.

Yeah. You need a bullet proof contract to prevent that from happening, and you need to be in charge of the money.

[directorik]

Originally Posted by Jetrefilm

Find a good producer – and not some thief who wants to be in charge of the budget so he or she can siphon off 40% of your budget to subsidize their unjustifiably lavish lifestyle. That’s not happened to me yet, but even the big studio have plunderers just hoping someone is stupid enough to put them in charge of a huge escrow account.

I'm curious about this statement. Do you have any examples
of this ever happening?

I'm not suggesting there aren't any bad people who are also
producers, but is this a real fear you have based on stories
you've read? It seems to me in the big studios the producers
are trying to find a way to keep earning a living and producing
movies. Not siphoning of 40% of a films budget so that can
live well.

Are there any big studio producers you feel do this?

[aceinc1]

Originally Posted by Jetrefilm

A film is made or marooned in the pre-production phase, specifically in the strength or weakness of its producers.

A producer who is not an alpha-minded, aggressive problem solver who cannot professionally and dispassionately project manage something as daring as even a small film project has no business being a part of your production.

Producers have a bad rap as the kill-joys and bean counters of a production who are always saying “no.”

That’s hyperbole, but its points to an underlying truth – you need someone with a cold, calculating perspective that can ensure the production is completed.

Find a good producer – and not some thief who wants to be in charge of the budget so he or she can siphon off 40% of your budget to subsidize their unjustifiably lavish lifestyle. That’s not happened to me yet, but even the big studio have plunderers just hoping someone is stupid enough to put them in charge of a huge escrow account.

• Make a rational list of milestones, then hit them.
• Keep your lines of communication open at all times. Weekly if not daily updates.
• Know where your money is going.
• Cut losses and personnel who cannot or will not perform up to your expectations.
• Make a great film, regardless of how much money you have.

Have fun.

David Jetre
Writer | Producer | Director

Dave,

I've written, directed and produced 8 films so far and to be honest you can only shoot what is available not what you want and this fact is what makes them lok like bad guys in the eyes of writers and directors.

nobody wants a bad product, a writer gets paid upfront so does a director but a producer has to run around after the production is over to market the product if has tried to save money in the produciton and not think of having a good product thenhe'll have a tough time selling it.

this might be offending to you but whoever says it sounds like a guy who has little to no idea about how movies get made.

regards,
Ace.Inc1

[Jetrefilm]

Since I am my own producer (with two others) I've not had to worry about people stealing from the ledger.

However, I recently watched two movies, both made for between $80K - $100K and I was dumb founded how poor they looked. This is not hyperbole, it looked like the shot with some cheap 1980's video camera. Everything was abominable: acting, lighting, directing, editing, production design, et al.

It was like they just showed up and, quickly through some lines out for some untalented actors to speak, and just winged it all.

When I pressed both production teams as to what the hell happened, they made all these excuses, but what really happened was quickly revealed: the management team spent all the money.

The writer took $25K, the director took about $25K, and the producer took about $25K. Bottom line, they paid themselves and invested nothing into the film.

Whereas my original comment was directed at producers, it really goes for any member of the executive team who takes a disproportionate amount of the film budget (i.e., the ledger) for fees.

These guys impoverished their own film and it shows. Worse, the film just sucks.

Neither me, nor my producers, have received a single dollar for our work on Shroud, and it is going on 24 months.

Of course, had we known how much hard work it was going to be, we would have gotten more money to shoot Shroud with and we would have been paid for our time. Oh, well, live and learn.

As far as producing -- of course, obviously, you do your best and you walk away with what you can. Film is not some arcane, impenetrable, inapprehensible mystery dance where you never know what you're going to get. There are variatioins, adaptations and adjustments, but you better have [expletive] vision or you are you are going to dash up against the rocks. In film, as in everything else, you damn well better know more than you don't know. Film is a journey: pick where you want to go, pack accordingly, and go there.

The whole point, guys, is to assemble the best team. That team is made up of positions, and what is great for one position is not necessarily best for another position.

So I repeat:

The Producer is a pivotal role that requires an assertive and analytical mind who can take the project from inception to distribution with skill, saavy, force if necessary, and innovation through an even hand and a cool head.

It's not rocket science -- it's movie making, which is far worse (lol).

Make a plan. Stick the plan. Change the plan when necessary. Find a good producer to enforce the plan.

Have fun.

Make a movie.

Share the memories.

Jetrefilm

[ATP]

Originally Posted by directorik

In my experience this attitude is essential<snip>Is that culture-bound?

Point taken. Culture-bound? Ham-fisted, playing hard ball, kicking head because you can? This may not be you, but if there are others out there like that, it might work for them, but not for me. I am at the point in my life, where I know what works for me, and what doesn't, whom I can work with, and whom I can not.

IF this same attitude encompasses an expectation that I (or anyone else) will work up to an 18 hour day, with the _possibility_ that I (they)_may_ be fed and provided suitable and sufficient liquid replenishments, as WDP did, then I am unable to state directly in a public forum such as this my thoughts for any who condones and/or employs such behaviour.



In relation to WDP, he has shown a serious character flaw, based on the attributes I have mentioned. In essence, I believe WDP to be slightly delusional. I think WDP is a bullshit artist, misleading everyone and no-one, and perhaps doesn't really believe his own PR. But WDP persists in using most any selling point he can to simply rope people in to fulfill his 'artistic vision', for what ultimately amounts to a vanity product, in much the same way as vanity publishing. It is going to go nowhere, and is unsaleable. There is really very little in it for anyone else. Something akin to this view has been independently confirmed by another party whom I know.

If you consider my view excessive, then what do you think of the this same person --WDP, a Westerner and first-time indie filmmaker-- who gets commitment by having people "buy" their role in his film? And the money raised in his fund-raising games nights (as entre to participation in his film) seemingly used to reimburse himself for his expenditure on his equipment?

Originally Posted by directorik

I cannot speak for David, but I can tell you with some level of
experience and understanding that we ALL are culture-bound in our
way of working. We cannot be any other way. I'm sure that if I were
producing in Asia I would have to change my methods based on
culture. But David isn't and I'm not. Your attack on David because he
doesn't share YOUR culture was uncalled for.

I would like to correct a misinterpretation. I am a Westerner--a Caucasian male, who has lived in Asia for many years.I explained earlier what I took exception to, and the circumstances surrounding it. If some here perceive me to have reacted excessively, then I think they might now know why.I did not want David's views to be misinterpreted and abused by such an example as I provided. He might very well be reading in this forum.

Originally Posted by directorik

You commented on one of David's points. I would love to hear your
comments on the other four <snip> based on your culture. A
culture that is very different than mine.

As our cultures are very similar ie. both of us are westerners, I think I am unable to comment as someone from another culture.

[Brooksy]

"IF this same attitude encompasses an expectation that I will work up to an 18 hour day, with the _possibility_ that I _may_ be fed and provided suitable and sufficient liquid replenishments, as he did, then I am unable to state directly in a public forum such as this my thoughts for any who condones such behaviour."

He really didn't feed you for 18 hours? What is suitable and sufficient liquid replenishments?

If this view is considered insufficient, or excessive, then what do you think of the (same) Western indie filmmaker who gets commitment by having people "buy" their role in his film? And the money raised in his fund-raising games nights (as entre to participation in his film) seemingly used to reimburse himself for his expenditure on his equipment?

David - Is this really how you spent the money you raised? People really didn't buy into their role did they?

[Jetrefilm]

ATP:

To whom are you referring:

"In relation to this chap, he has shown a serious character flaw, based on the attributes I have mentioned. In essence, I believe him to be slightly delusional. I think he is a bullshit artist, misleading everyone and no-one, and perhaps doesn't really believe his own PR. But he persists in using most any selling point he can to simply rope people in to fulfill his 'artistic vision', for what ultimately amounts to a vanity product, in much the same way as vanity publishing. It is going to go nowhere, and is unsaleable. There is really very little in it for anyone else. Something akin to this view has been independently confirmed by another party whom I know."

Jetrefilm

[Jetrefilm]

Guys, you must be MORE SPECIFIC if you are addressing a point I've made.

TO BROOSKY:

Are you referring me when you ask:

"David - Is this really how you spent the money you raised? People really didn't buy into their role did they?"

Because you are not citing my opinions, but ATP's.

So clarity?

David

[ATP]

Originally Posted by Jetrefilm

ATP:

To whom are you referring:

"In relation to this chap, he has shown a serious character flaw, based on the attributes I have mentioned. In essence, I believe him to be slightly delusional. I think he is a bullshit artist, misleading everyone and no-one, and perhaps doesn't really believe his own PR. But he persists in using most any selling point he can to simply rope people in to fulfill his 'artistic vision', for what ultimately amounts to a vanity product, in much the same way as vanity publishing. It is going to go nowhere, and is unsaleable. There is really very little in it for anyone else. Something akin to this view has been independently confirmed by another party whom I know."

Jetrefilm

Hmmm. For all concerned, my references are to Writer-Producer-Director (WPD for short) to whom I referred in post #2. NOT David.

[ATP]

Originally Posted by Brooksy

"IF this same attitude encompasses an expectation that I will work up to an 18 hour day, with the _possibility_ that I _may_ be fed and provided suitable and sufficient liquid replenishments, as he did, then I am unable to state directly in a public forum such as this my thoughts for any who condones such behaviour."

He really didn't feed you for 18 hours? What is suitable and sufficient liquid replenishments?

If this view is considered insufficient, or excessive, then what do you think of the (same) Western indie filmmaker who gets commitment by having people "buy" their role in his film? And the money raised in his fund-raising games nights (as entre to participation in his film) seemingly used to reimburse himself for his expenditure on his equipment?

David - Is this really how you spent the money you raised? People really didn't buy into their role did they?

Please kindly re-read post #2.

[Jetrefilm]

Anything else anybody want to bring up?

Jetrefilm

[Brooksy]

Oh... sorry. My bad. I was confused obviously. I thought because ATP talked about a writer-director-producer and then David called himself a writer-director-producer that I thought... well nevermind. I apologize for my previous posts. I get it now I think...

[Jetrefilm]

It's all good.

Jetrefilm

[Amburlesk]

I have been a producer, first, followed by Actor, Director, and writer as well as the C.E.O. of my own production company. On my web site, which I admit could and will become better, as I learn more about making a web page. I have been in show business since I was in diapers more and I do mean a whole lot more than fifty years ago. I have made money and I have lost a lot of money making my own films and other productions. I have ghost produced (did their paper work without screen credit) on more than 4815 productions. I give this information as a basis for the next few statements. As a producer that has been in charge of investor's money, dipping into the escrow account can lead to a lot of legal problems including violations of several SEC rules. Secondly, the film industry is a very small world and word about that kind of dishonesty will kill your chances of working on very many more, if any, productions. When i worked for studio, I was paid a Producer's fee that amounted to 5% of the total budget, but even that is misleading because a lot of the residuals for actors actually came out of my end. I spend a lot of hours on any film I do. I make the budget, the schedules, approve the script, deal with the unions and their insane contracts, deal with vendors, actors, and crew, secure locations, rent or buy equipment, arrange paychecks, negotiate distribution contracts, meet the various fringe requirements and the labor requirement set by the various government agencies that we have to do to make a movie, acquire insurances, work out publicity campaigns and advertising, attend film festival, industry conferences, and try to convince the director that using a camera on a jib will give them a better artistic shot than the helicopter, that costs a lot more money, and anything else that comes up during development, preproduction, production,post production, and after release. My least favorite job is firing someone that needs to leave. I do not like to do it but if my film is going out of whack because someone, then I will cut out the poison. I do it because I have learned from being to nice in this respect that it cost the production more money, and in a few cases, actually cause the shoot to collapse and that is not fair to the people who worked their tails off to make something wonderful. The good news is that it happens a very rarely. After reading your posts, I agree with your assessment of what a producer is and what he or she does. Keep up the good work.

In addition, on a lighter side of things, one of the posts asked if any producer is going up to Astoria, Oregon give him a call. Well, I have been there (Kindergarten Cop) and found it quite lovely but you have a group of Sea Lions at your marina and one of them took my Rolex. If I come up there again, I want a SEA Lion Guard