Home Your Ad Here

Go Back   IndieTalk - Indie Film Forum > Tools of the Trade > Cameras

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-13-2017, 11:32 AM   #1
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
Post $7000 to Create a Film Arsenal

Hello indietalk.com, I have recently come into an educational fund worth $7000, and can only be spent on tuition or equipment. I have my tuition covered so all 7k is going towards gear. I'm trying to create a well rounded arsenal so I can create my own indie films without anyone else's equipment.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/wi...p#/A6D3FB0F2C/

Here is a link to a B&H wishlist I've put together. I'm pretty satisfied with the gear I've chosen, I would just like a few expert opinions before I blow this 7k. I wanna know I'm getting the best equipment I can afford.
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Today   #1A
film guy
Basic Member
 
Posts: 17

 
Old 01-13-2017, 12:59 PM   #2
AcousticAl
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 473
Just out of curiosity:

- Why are you getting the stereo shotgun mic array?

- What made you choose the fluorescent lighting fixtures you chose?
AcousticAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 01:30 PM   #3
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
Post

-I chose the Sennheiser because it is essentially two shotgun mics rather than one, so it can pick up noise in a wider spread than your average shotgun. It also has great noise cancellation anywhere you're not facing the mic. It also has a high pass filter.

-I went with the florescents that I did because I like the warmer look as opposed to LEDs which just kinda make everything whiter. Also I chose the forescents over any tungsten lights cause tungsten gets way too hot and consumes way too much power. The lights I chose only consume 55w but are equivalent to 500w tungstens.
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 02:07 PM   #4
AcousticAl
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
-I chose the Sennheiser because it is essentially two shotgun mics rather than one, so it can pick up noise in a wider spread than your average shotgun. It also has great noise cancellation anywhere you're not facing the mic. It also has a high pass filter.
Exactly. It picks up noise in a wider spread. The whole point to a shotgun mic is that it has a narrow focus, so adding a second one to widen that field essentially defeats the purpose.

If you plan on using this at all for on-camera dialog, you are spending $400 on a useless microphone. Dialog is a mono source. Recording on-cam dialog with a stereo mic array can cause all sorts of headaches in post. Use a single, focused pickup pattern (shotgun, perhaps add a true hypercardioid for places where a shotgun doesn't behave). For that $400, you could get a decent shotgun kit based around the AT-875, including a boom pole, lyre shockmount, and ample windscreening.

I'd also suggest going with the Tascam DR-60DmkII over the DR-05, especially if you go with the AT-875. You'll need XLR connection and phantom power.

And I don't see good, closed-back headphones on your list. How will you monitor sound?

Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
-I went with the florescents that I did because I like the warmer look as opposed to LEDs which just kinda make everything whiter. Also I chose the forescents over any tungsten lights cause tungsten gets way too hot and consumes way too much power. The lights I chose only consume 55w but are equivalent to 500w tungstens.
Cheap fluorescent lights can have sickly color casts and can cause strobing in the images. Same can be said for cheap LED, but even cheap LED has come a long way. The Aputure Amaran lights are pretty dang solid.

I would double up on the 5-in-1 reflectors, and get a couple of stands and a couple of reflector holders to go with them.

And do you really need a drone and a gimbal at this point? Drones require licensing plus a buttload of practice to get right. The gimbal is the "everybody and their brother-in-law's third cousin" has one hot tool right now (aside from the drone) and is getting a little old to see in every video. But that's just my opinion. I do, though, see drones and gimbals as luxuries when the lighting and sound game are more important up front.

Last edited by AcousticAl; 01-13-2017 at 02:13 PM.
AcousticAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 02:24 PM   #5
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
Post

I see your points about the mic, but why would a stereo mic be great at picking up singing and even you know rapping which is pretty much just talking, and be terrible at picking up simpler audio? if you know what i mean

I already have headphones that i'm very happy with
https://www.marshallheadphones.com/m.../monitor-black

And on the lighting topic are you suggesting I dont get any florescents and just get LEDs?

Ronin is a must for me. I work with it a lot with my mentor and I'm sold.

In Colorado the whole drone licencing thing isn't so bad, especially because at first I'll just be trying to build a film portfolio/resume. I won't be trying to sell my footage yet.
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 04:29 PM   #6
AcousticAl
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
I see your points about the mic, but why would a stereo mic be great at picking up singing and even you know rapping which is pretty much just talking, and be terrible at picking up simpler audio? if you know what i mean
Audio for music recording and audio for film/TV/video are two entirely different beasts, calling for different tools and different applications.

Of course, even in the recording stufio, a singer or rapper is not recorded with a stereo mic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
And on the lighting topic are you suggesting I dont get any florescents and just get LEDs?
Pretty much. I have worked with a few of those cheap-ass fluoro kits and they always look terrible. I have worked with several low-cost LEDs and have, with a few exceptions (read: Neewer units off Amazon), gotten good-to-great results. If LED looks too neutral for you, that's where color grading comes in. It's harder when you have to start by color-correcting a sickly green or magenta color cast just to get back to neutral.
AcousticAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2017, 12:39 AM   #7
Alcove Audio
Basic - Premiere Expired
 
Alcove Audio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Fairfield County, CT
Posts: 7,429
Here's my $1,500 buying guide; it makes a decent prosumer production sound kit.


Shotgun mic kits will have the shotgun mic, boom-pole, shock-mount and simple wind protection (softie).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...icrophone.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Condenser.html


Hypercardioid mic:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ET_Pencil.html

My old favorite the SE1a is no longer available. Anything else I like for production sound is in the $500 up range.



Audio recorders:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...recording.html

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ..._for_dslr.html

Any decent audio recorder with XLR inputs will do the job, but these are "aimed" at indie filmmakers.



Headphones:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Headphone.html

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...D_25_1_II.html



You'll also need cables, cases, battery packs and other miscellaneous items - about $200 to $500.





Crappy production sound destroys more otherwise worthy projects than any other technical issue.


Your project will only look as good as it sounds, because
"Sound is half of the experience"

If your film looks terrible but has great sound, people might just think it's your aesthetic.
If your film looks great and has bad sound, people will think you're an amateur.
Sound is the first indicator to the industry that you know what you're doing.
Alcove Audio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2017, 01:49 AM   #8
jax_rox
IndieTalk Moderator
 
jax_rox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,755
What sort of projects are you going to be making? What role will you take? I.e. will you be Directing? Operating the camera? Lighting? All? Some? None? Hiring someone to swing a boom?
jax_rox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2017, 11:05 AM   #9
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,181
Now you have audio covered...

Those are poor choices for lights. But if that's the look you
like I won't argue. In everything but an interview two fluorescent
lights and a ring light aren't going to cut it. You don't need a
high end Arri kit but you DON'T need a ring ever and you should
have at least five lights in a well rounded arsenal.

Are you sure that right now you need $1,000 worth of drone and
$330 worth of lights? Will you use the drone in more shots than
your lights? Drones are fun and can add production value to a shot
or two - a great light kit is essential and can add production value
to each and every shot.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 08:03 AM   #10
elemental
Basic Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Finland
Posts: 87
What I think about that set is here:

Sound:
If you are doing videos with sound buy better mic. You going to thank people later. I don't have experience about that recorder but I think I have the basic dr60d and its good run and go recorder. With that I have ntg 2 and some wireles set.

Light:
That Impact frc light going to be pain in ass because the light goes softly all around so it is hard to block, because you dont have doors on it. That light kit is better if you like soft light. I would buy some more spot light with them to make hair light or little bit shapes in picture.

Slider:
If you want to realy use it you need 2 extra stand for it to get it right angle and height.

Lenses:

I dont know what is the crop factor on GH5, but do you realy need 12mm and 12-35mm same time. Do you shoot stars or something?

but in the end it depends what are you doing. If you have lot of outdoor location it would be good to have some led lights with option to use battery's then you don't need generator. I would chance the ronin to the wireles mic set to get good sound, because I am not so good at sound so if I don't hear well the talk on the video the hole video is worthless.

And I would buy first the 12-35 lens and then think again do I need more light or some other lenses to grow the range.
elemental is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 10:56 AM   #11
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
I see that XLR audio is the way to go but I will be filming by myself quite often and XLR audio is a real bitch if you don't have two people at least. I don't want to always heave to rely on someone else to be there with me. So there are no quality hotshoe mics at all? Like if I'm gonna have a XLR boom mic as my primary that kinda ruins the whole ronin experience cause it won't work if the cameras plugged into a 30 ft XLR cable. Really kinda trying to be a one man army here.

And what are some decent lights then guys? I can't find any quality looking LEDs for under like $500. And I'm not working with tungsten because F@!$ that headache.

The drone I'm getting cause of all its capabilities. Even if I don't use it to film too much I will definitely be using it to shoot skate videos.

I really want to have a wide field of view on my camera. Very important. The MFT sensor doubles the mm of each lens so my "super wide angle" lenses only equate to about 24mm. Also the lower mm size you pick usually the lower your f/ is too. That is also imperative because that's the one thing the GH5 doesn't excel at is low light performance. And I thought it'd be smart to buy a zoom lens with the capability of having the same look as my prime lense so I don't have to go back and forth too often.

Am I sounding naive guys?
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 11:33 AM   #12
directorik
IndieTalk's Resident Guru
 
directorik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: hollywood
Posts: 9,181
Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
Am I sounding naive guys?
Not necessarily.

As you can see when you give people partial information you will get
answers that don't suit your needs.

When I read' “well rounded arsenal” I though of someone making narrative
movies with a small crew and documentaries. But your primary need is
equipment for skate videos and shooting yourself. So not so much a "well
rounded arsenal” as equipment for your specific shooting requirements.

I wish I had known that before I offered my suggestions. A drone is far
more important than good lights for your needs. Those three lights will
be fine. Perhaps that stereo mic is best for what you are planning to shoot.
That and the lights you mention will limit you in some ways, but may work
best for what you are currently shooting.
directorik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 12:59 PM   #13
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
When I said well rounded arsenal I meant like having equipment with the versatility to shoot skate videos, or movies, or documentaries or whatever all decently.
I would certainly like to be able to create narrative movies with my equipment. I'm just saying I will often be all on my own so I don't want equipment that requires another person any time I really wanna use it. In the future I will for sure expand my arsenal but for now I can't really rely on extra people.

And I think you guys might be selling the Sennheiser mic short. It's a new innovative design targeting run-and-gun filmmakers. It's trying to bridge the gap between having to use stereo in some cases and having to use mono for others. This is the future, maybe some new mics are good for both applications if you guys know what I mean.

I've changed my list a little now, take another look. You can't put the same item on the wishlist more than once but now I'm thinking 4 of those aperture amarans.
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/wi...p#/A6D3FB0F2C/

Last edited by urmomsadude; 01-15-2017 at 01:05 PM.
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 01:50 PM   #14
AcousticAl
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
When I said well rounded arsenal I meant like having equipment with the versatility to shoot skate videos, or movies, or documentaries or whatever all decently.
I would certainly like to be able to create narrative movies with my equipment. I'm just saying I will often be all on my own so I don't want equipment that requires another person any time I really wanna use it. In the future I will for sure expand my arsenal but for now I can't really rely on extra people.
For that kind of versatility, you'd be better off spending the entire $7k on lighting and sound. Pick up an ARRI Softbank IV Plus kit (5 lights with accessories) for $4k and then invest in a decent audio outfit with shotgun and boom kit and at least one wireless system. Wireless is your friend for one-man-band run-and-gun. $3k can go a long way on a basic sound kit.

As a one-man band, plunk a RØDE VideoMic Pro on your camera to grab nats of skate sounds. But keep a decent sound kit available for interviews. You can record the sound separately and sync it in post. This will give you the flexibility you want. There's no reason that you have to keep any XLR cables tethered to your camera.

Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
And I think you guys might be selling the Sennheiser mic short. It's a new innovative design targeting run-and-gun filmmakers. It's trying to bridge the gap between having to use stereo in some cases and having to use mono for others. This is the future, maybe some new mics are good for both applications if you guys know what I mean.
I think you might be putting too much stock into the marketing materials you read. This mic is not the future; it's a novelty with limited use. Stereo recording for video/film production has extremely limited application.

Again, mono is crucial for dialog and pretty much most other things. If you need stereo recording for ambient sound beds, keep a little handheld recorder in your bag, like the DR-22WL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by urmomsadude View Post
I've changed my list a little now, take another look. You can't put the same item on the wishlist more than once but now I'm thinking 4 of those aperture amarans.
Those little Aputure lights are not very powerful. I should have been more specific. A couple of them can be handy for camera-top and tight spaces, but to light an interview with any semblance of power, or to take in narrative shorts and features, you'll need, at the very least, the larger Amaran panels. Get a couple of the wides and a couple of the spots.
AcousticAl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2017, 09:32 PM   #15
urmomsadude
Basic Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Color-Rad-O
Posts: 6
Alright you guys have persuaded me. I think i will replace the Sennheiser with these, let me know what you think;

Tascam DR-70D (thanks Alcove Audio for the suggestion)
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...recording.html

Rode M5 Compact 1/2" Condenser
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...pair_2_m5.html
Edit: So I hadn't noticed but these Rodes are Stereo as well, so should I opt for these instead? (It doesn't say mono anywhere on the page but I'm led to believe they are)
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...icrophone.html
A couple 15 foot cables should do the trick. Is there anything else i need in order for this sound setup to work?

Also a question about the Amarans; the Sony batteries that they recommend are like almost just as expensive as the lights! Like jesus! But my question is would some Dracast NP-F batteries work on the Amarans?
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...batteries.html

Last edited by urmomsadude; 01-15-2017 at 10:12 PM.
urmomsadude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
dji, equipment & gear, film, gh5, indie


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.


©IndieTalk