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Old 06-27-2012, 01:24 PM   #16
Boxt
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Excellent advice.

I'll add one thing, give them plenty of time to block out the actor's schedule. It is really difficult to get a busy actor, even B-, if you're calling up 1 month before.
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:40 PM   #17
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It doesn't matter where you are if an actor is union they can only do a union projects. All professional actors are union. An actor that works outside of the union is flirting with getting kicked out of their union. No bueno.

I have both an agent and a manager and they work very similarly these days. Managers have less clients and focus more on individual actor's careers. They are usually available 24/7 to their actors. Agents typically have more clients and although the focus on their actors they tend to be more concerned with the bottom dollar. But they do care about the actors career. These days agents and managers do the exact same thing save one thing: Negotiations. It is illegal (at least in the state of california for a manager to negotiate a contract). They use lawyers to skip around these laws.

Its different if you contact an A lister's manager vs a guy with a couple of guest stars, obviously. The guy with a couple of guest stars is much more likely to at least hear about your project because their manager wants to get them more leads to show that they can carry a feature or a show. These are the people (recognizable faces but not recognizable names) that you are most likely to get. But again, your project will have to be union.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:24 PM   #18
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It doesn't matter where you are if an actor is union they can only do a union projects. All professional actors are union. An actor that works outside of the union is flirting with getting kicked out of their union. No bueno.
That is not correct. You can opt out of SAG/ Global Rule One as a production. They are perfectly valid and actors do not get kicked out unions for working on SAG opt-out movies. Talk to any media lawyer and they will tell you how it is done. I know this for a FACT.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:45 PM   #19
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Thanks, cleared an awful lot up!

I don't have any specific names in mind but I've seen some that are union, some not in a union.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:51 PM   #20
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Thanks, cleared an awful lot up!

I don't have any specific names in mind but I've seen some that are union, some not in a union.
Go for the best actor you can afford.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:54 PM   #21
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Go for the best actor you can afford.
That's pretty much what I'll be doing. If I do end up working with a non-union actor, I might see if I can negotiate not paying them and making up for it in some other way. We'll see what happens I guess
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Old 06-27-2012, 06:15 PM   #22
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That's pretty much what I'll be doing. If I do end up working with a non-union actor, I might see if I can negotiate not paying them and making up for it in some other way. We'll see what happens I guess
In the UK you are not allowed to defer 100% of anyone's salary or fee. Just bear that in mind...

Are you directing, producing?

Is it a short or a feature?
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Old 06-27-2012, 06:36 PM   #23
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That is not correct. You can opt out of SAG/ Global Rule One as a production. They are perfectly valid and actors do not get kicked out unions for working on SAG opt-out movies. Talk to any media lawyer and they will tell you how it is done. I know this for a FACT.
Careful what you're passing around as facts: This is directly against SAG-AFTRA Global Rule 1 for SAG-AFTRA. This would have to be something that the actor not the production would have to "Opt" out of. Not the production. A SAG-AFTRA actor can only work on SAG-AFTRA Signatory projects, unless the actor goes fi-core. This is a completely different story. A FiCore actor is not a card carrying member of the union anymore...they've lost their rights to vote on union matters but they can still act on sag projects. Very few actors go this route as it defeats the purpose of a union. There are only a handful of well known actors out there that have gone FiCore. Why? because...if you're making great money as an actor you don't need to do non union...plain and simple. Jon Voight, Charlton Heston are a two of the most famous ficore actors. Again these aren't SAG-AFTRA actors...these are SAG-AFTRA FiCore. There is a difference.

Before you retort, I spoke to my union reps today in case I was missing something or there was some odd out of the US clauses and they confirmed my thoughts. A SAG-AFTRA Member may not work on a project unless it is signatory regardless of where it is. The End.
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Old 06-27-2012, 06:43 PM   #24
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Before you retort, I spoke to my union reps today in case I was missing something or there was some odd out of the US clauses and they confirmed my thoughts. A SAG-AFTRA Member may not work on a project unless it is signatory regardless of where it is. The End.
As I said, they do not promote the fact that you can opt-out but you can.
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Old 06-27-2012, 06:53 PM   #25
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As I said, they do not promote the fact that you can opt-out but you can.
There is no such thing....again...this has nothing to do with with what the production wants. It's the actor's union. Not the productions. Actors would have to "opt-out". The closest thing to what you are saying is FiCore...and it's permanent.
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Old 06-27-2012, 07:03 PM   #26
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There is no such thing....again...this has nothing to do with with what the production wants. It's the actor's union. Not the productions. Actors would have to "opt-out". The closest thing to what you are saying is FiCore...and it's permanent.

I understand that you are just repeating what your union has told you and it is in their interest to keep people believing one thing over another, but do me a favour and talk to a media lawyer at one of the established media law firms before you say anything else.
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Old 06-27-2012, 07:26 PM   #27
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I understand that you are just repeating what your union has told you and it is in their interest to keep people believing one thing over another, but do me a favour and talk to a media lawyer at one of the established media law firms before you say anything else.
How about this. Prove it. Give me an example of a film that did this. Show me a law. Anything.
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Old 06-27-2012, 07:47 PM   #28
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How about this. Prove it. Give me an example of a film that did this. Show me a law. Anything.
Taft-Hartley guarantees US employers the rights to hire union labour on non-union projects.I won't name other people's films as that is for them to do but I have one feature which has opted out.
I can pretty much guess that you will reject both of these, so I say again, go talk to a media lawyer, and they will explain it to you. Talk to them first and the come back and discuss. Really, stop replying until you've checked what I've said with a lawyer.
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Old 06-27-2012, 09:13 PM   #29
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The burden of proof lies on you mi amigo. I'm not trying to be a jerk. I fully respect any proof i'm given but I know by unions laws. If you're suggesting that there our a government law that creates a loophole id honestly like to know it. You're telling me to consult a lawyer. I don't feel any need to spend money consulting a lawyer to solve a debate you can easily just give proof of and end the debate. Film title and actor that was union at time of shooting.... Will solve everything.

You're not giving any evidence.... You're just stating that you can break a unions rules and expecting me to nod and say ok. I've studied business law back in my college days...... I have a pretty firm grasp of something when I read it. I obviously don't want to be misinformed...this by no means is an attack.


You're acting like telling me a film example that did this isnt morally right. Why? If what is being done is by the book why can't you say?


Here is what I've found regarding Taft-Hartley and the entertainment industry.

The term Taft-Hartley has a special meaning in the entertainment industry. Specifically, for film and television actors, an actor not in the union who becomes a "principal performer" (says a line) is immediately eligible to join the Screen Actors Guild and is covered under the SAG contract with the production company for 30 days, at which point he or she must either join SAG or cease working on any union productions; this same provision applies to so-called "background actors" (extras) who work on a SAG covered production for 3 or more days. Once joining the union, the actor may not work on any non-union production, per the terms of the bylaws. This allows SAG to get around the rules forbidding closed shops by providing a mechanism for new members to join the union.

Last edited by bez; 06-27-2012 at 09:17 PM.
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Old 06-27-2012, 09:27 PM   #30
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Whether other producers wish to advertise the fact they opt out is up to them. Many choose not to because they are subjected to ill-informed diatribes, other like George Lucas don't care who says what to them. I am one of many people who have opted-out, legitimately. Just because you have not heard of or experienced something, it does not mean you can go round saying it does not exist.

You don't have to pay a lawyer, you can Skype any UK media lawyer and talk to them free of charge for the first hour.

Also, unions don't make laws, they make union policies. Where union policies conflict with law, they are unenforcable.
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