canon 6D questions

WhiteOpus

WhiteOpus

I am confused, why can't I find the recording bitrate for the Canon 6D ANYWHERE online? Nor can I find the Color subsampling (4:2:2, 4:4:4, etc). Can anyone fill in the blanks here?

One other small thing: Is there ANY possibility that I was sold a defective camera? It just feels like the footage I get out of the 6D is soft and "digital" looking. I shoot in a very flat picture style in order to have an easier time in post, but even after doing that the coloring is an absolute hassle with very little wiggle room before the picture just gets muddy and bad. What could I be doing wrong?

For comparison, I have shot video with a three-point lighting setup, on a tripod; the video STILL looks WAY below the quality of random test videos shot in someone's kitchen with tungsten lighting (not to mention they're compressed via youtube as well). :huh:
 
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you need to post your settings aswell as your footage, your footage looks digital because it is digital, but you can do things to make it more film like, by film like i mean Film not as in a movie which is what im guessing your referring to, you need to remember a couple of things:

1. whatever settings you copy from other people it will never look as good as their because they have shot for what they wanted with their settings, in order for you to get a good image you need to adjust your settings and shoot for what you want and for what you begin to feel looks good.

2. Shooting flat on a canon DSLR is risky business, when i had a 600d shooting with cinestyle I kept most things only two notches down rather than turning it all the way down, it was easier to grade and presented a much better image for me.

3. I believe your canon 6d is 4:2:0 8bit theres no chance it is more, otherwise it would touted as a hot camera which to be honest its not really apart from ISO noise performance.

4. consider getting Film Convert (highly recommended) it will transform your footage and i personally would not ever be without it ever again (im considering looking into Impulz Luts).

5. the camera can only capture what is on screen, its your job to make the scene look cinematic.
 
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I just looked at the mirror, there was a small smudge on one of the corners (probably from the previous owner fiddling around in there...ugh). Would it be beneficial to have my camera cleaned and "tuned up"? There's a guy who does it for $75, takes a weekend. He's very well known so there's no concern with the quality of work, but is this even going to change anything, image quality-wise?
 
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I haven't had a lot to do with the 6D:

Color Subsampling: 4:2:0. You'll have to check the manual to see if you can get a higher sampling rate by using an external recorder. It's a shot in the dark.

Bitrate is only a guess that it'll fall into the 50 to 70mbit range, most likely in the middle. Since you're already shooting with the camera, you should be able to look it up yourself from the footage you've already shot.

It just feels like the footage I get out of the 6D is soft and "digital" looking.
Click to expand...

It'll look digital because it is, though I suspect you mean something else.

I shoot in a very flat picture style in order to have an easier time in post, but even after doing that the coloring is an absolute hassle with very little wiggle room before the picture just gets muddy and bad. What could I be doing wrong?
Click to expand...

This is really hard to diagnose remotely without *ANY* information, examples, before/after screen shots, what you're using, what you're doing with it etc. It could have been errors while shooting (over exposed, under exposed - though from your post, it suggests that you're careful of this) causing artifacts. It could be that you're trying to push the footage too far in grading, causing banding due to the limitations in the codec/data not being there in the footage, which would essentially cause blotching.
 
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Sweetie said:
This is really hard to diagnose remotely without *ANY* information, examples, before/after screen shots, what you're using, what you're doing with it etc.
Click to expand...

I will do a few tests during daylight today and then some more tests later tonight under tungsten lighting (as I mentioned the other test videos do). I'll post screencaps and maybe a download link to a short sample video (to see the noise "in action"). Come back tonight!
 
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The 6D will record a 1920*1080 frame at 91 Mbps (ALL-I) or 31 Mbps (IPB). Use ALL-I for the best picture quality.

Shooting flat can be very useful but is not always appropriate. In a lower contrast situation (such as an interview with a controlled three point lighting setup) shooting very flat may be compromising your image - if there are no very bright or very dark areas in the frame you are effectively squeezing the useful information into a much smaller range, throwing away bits which will soon become apparent when you try and stretch it out again in post.

How are you exposing the image? Are you using a light meter or any exposure tools on the camera?
 
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WhiteOpus said:
I just looked at the mirror, there was a small smudge on one of the corners (probably from the previous owner fiddling around in there...ugh). Would it be beneficial to have my camera cleaned and "tuned up"? There's a guy who does it for $75, takes a weekend. He's very well known so there's no concern with the quality of work, but is this even going to change anything, image quality-wise?
Click to expand...

Do you wear glasses?

I guess not ;)

I do and I can tell you that a smudge make a difference.


but the mirror is retracted while shooting, so that can't be it.
Never the less if the mirror is that dirty, maybe the chip isn't clean either... it never hurts to check.


About shooting flat.
It works great with raw footage or really high bitrates with 4:2:2 subsampling or more.
For 4:2:0 it might not be the best solution, because you really need to push the codec to make it look good, while the codec itself doesn't like to be pushed...
IMHO

I rarely shoot flat, btw. Saves me a lot of time :P
 
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chilipie said:
How are you exposing the image? Are you using a light meter or any exposure tools on the camera?
Click to expand...
I am using the in-camera light meter and custom white balance via an 18% gray card.
WalterB said:
About shooting flat.
It works great with raw footage or really high bitrates with 4:2:2 subsampling or more.
For 4:2:0 it might not be the best solution, because you really need to push the codec to make it look good, while the codec itself doesn't like to be pushed...
IMHO

I rarely shoot flat, btw. Saves me a lot of time :P
Click to expand...
I actually I just got to a configuration of the picture settings that work best for me. It's truly not one-size-fits-all. Here're a couple screenshots of some test stuff I shot. Details are:
-1/60 (I like the shutter speed a little faster when doing handheld. Makes warp stabilizer look far better, IMO.
-f/3.5
-ISO 1600
-Picture settings: Sharpness: 5, Contrast: -4, Saturation: -4, Color Tone: 0 (sharpness up 1, contrast all the way down, saturation all the way down, color tone left as-is)
-1920x1080 24p ALL-I (75.5mpbs)
-Lighting setup was basically just all the lights (there are three) turned on in my kitchen
-Samples below are not corrected/graded
2cxdmwn.png

18lptx.png

2ic7d46.png
 
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this was shot the same night, but at a higher ISO. It occurs to me now that the problem I have with my camera isn't as much the noise as it is the inability it has to capture detail at long distances (even beyond 20 feet). This may be a problem with the lens (I typically use a 40mm pancake), but I feel like it could also be the camera. I'll continue to post screenshots/videos of my issues. Thanks for the responses everyone, I genuinely appreciate it.:)
 
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I don't know. I rather liked it. At what distance were you shooting the cat from?

It looks like you have a pretty shallow depth of field going on in the cat video. Is that broken lens the same 40mm pancake that you typically use?

Do you have some video in which you're trying to shoot something twenty plus feet away and not getting good detail? And what lens(es) are you using to shoot subjects twenty plus feet away? At what F stop? Are you having difficulty with focus, or are you getting good focus but still getting video without detail?

Without seeing it, it's difficult to say. But I really wouldn't think it would be the camera, unless there's a malfunction or damage of some kind.
 
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This was not the 40mm pancake, as I didn't have the footage on me at the time I posted that. I'll upload the footage I'm dissatisfied with today, as I have the hard drive at work with me today.


This was an aspherical lens I found with no electronics, no way to change aperture and a small blemish on the front glass.
I used my shortest extension tube to attach the lens (the faulty electronics locked up the camera if attached directly) to my Canon 6D.
Lift/Gamma/Gain & white balance corrected
Held up alright!

1/50
F/??? (this lens is broken, found it at home in an old box)
ISO 3200
picture settings: Sharpness: 5, Contrast: -4, Saturation: -4, Color tone: 0

1920x1080 24p ALL-I (downsampled to vimeo's god awful 720 "HD")


--------------------------
 
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Okay, finally had a chance to use the 40mm at a shoot earlier today.

Here's a small sample of that.
Here's a link to download the .mp4

The Canon over the shoulder is the 6D - Canon 40mm. The 550D is the one on the table - Sigma Aspherical 28-80mm.
It's funny because IMO the 550D almost looks better than the 6D, but perhaps I'm just falsely convincing myself of that.

***
picture settings:
Sharpness: 3
Contrast: -4
Saturation: -4
Color Tone: 0
***
corrected:
(fast color corrector)
Lift/Gamma/Gain
white balance
(RGB curves) - minor luma S curve

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'm using two 50 watt fluorescent lamps (one with a wide "snoot" made of blackwrap and another with a wider "snoot" blocking light from spilling onto the backdrop and limiting the amount of light let onto the silhouette) and a reflector on the right side of the woman's shoulder
 
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I don't know, but it looks fine to me, anyway, for whatever that's worth. But the last thing I am is anything like an expert. Hopefully more knowledgeable people will have a look at it.

I suppose if it really does bother you, and you're sure it's the camera...I suppose you could sell it and get a different camera. Thankfully, it's not like you're married to it. Or...you can get a divorce.

Are you in the market for another good lens? Maybe another good lens would give you the performance you're looking for, or help you determine if it's the camera or a lens issue. Do you happen to have a local friend with a compatible good lens who can let you take it for a spin on your 6D? I would think that an EF lens, since we're talking a full frame camera, might show off the camera's true virtues...or shortcomings the best?

Edit:

So you're using the Canon EF 40mm f/2.8 STM Lens? After just looking it up, looks like it's getting plenty of love from customer reviews on B&H. Sounds like you already have a good lens there. But, if convenient, couldn't hurt to try another good lens or two...
 
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