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After Effects exporting DPX - not correct!

S

Scotty Fox

Hey All,

Here's my problem.

Have a grade done already in Davinci Resolve. Getting DPX files back from my VFX artist to place back in Resolve and apply the final grade. All is working fine. (So in resolve I have a mix of r3d files and dpx files.)

But, since I'm operating Resolve Lite there is no noise removal. So I want to use Neat Video which I have for After Effects NOT Resolve. (don't have the cash at this point to purchase a license for Resolve as well)

So to do that I'm taking the dpx files that have vfx applied and bringing them into AE. I apply the noise removal, looks fine, then export the dpx file again. I bring back into Resolve and apply the grade and compare it and it's not the same.

It's slightly warmer than it's supposed to be and doesn't match. Now I know it's my fault coming out of AE because I can take the completed dpx file from vfx artist and bring into Resolve, apply the grade and it matches perfectly. So I know it's something I'm doing regarding color management in AE.

I've tried most things (that I know of - and that's not much in regards to color profiles, management, etc.) so I know I'm missing something.

Exposure and all seems to be just fine, it's just the color temperature that's not right.

Any ideas or info about how I should be exporting the dpx file to keep it EXACTLY THE SAME as before would be great.

Neat Video wouldn't warm something up like this would it?

Thanks everyone.
 
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Ah update.

After playing around with exports, etc. I've figured it is indeed Neat Video causing the temp shift.

My thought is it's probably removing the noise, which itself has some color to it (cool). So by taking it out I'm revealing more of the warmth in the shot.

I'm going to try doing the noise removal after the grade has been applied. Maybe this will make a difference.
 
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So I'm having a forum discussion with myself but here's another update for those who may have some idea what the heck is happening.

In short this is what I've discovered.



-Have DPX VFX files 10 bit log ungraded.

-Need to apply Noise Reduction so used Neat Video in AE.

-Upon bringing DPX into Resolve (after exporting from AE) to reapply grade, the color temperature is different (when I apply the grade).

-This temp change ONLY happens when applying Neat Video or another filter i.e. Gaussian Blur in AE.

-Temp change does NOT happen if I simply export the DPX out of AE and bring into Resolve and add the grade. So it's not in the AE DPX export settings...

-WHY is this happening when I apply filters? Anybody have any idea?

Any help would be extremely appreciated!
 
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Is your projectin AE set to 16bpc? It defaults to 8bpc, it's possible that once you apply a filter and render the conversion from 10bit video to 8bit space is resulting in the visible color shift.
 
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Thanks for the response!

It is set to 16bpc. I remember checking the DPX export settings to make are it wasn't 8... but I could recheck tonight. Unless it's converting back to 8 without my knowledge...
 
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Hey Will,

I double checked that. The project settings are 16bpc, and also when I go into the export settings for DPX I set my main settings to 16bpc.

Then there is the file format option where I can select my bit depth for 8, 10, 12 or 16. Since the files are 10-bit log originally, I've kept it here. Also kept it here for any r3d files I export to DPX.

Not sure if I'm missing anything else but let me know.

I downloaded AE 2014 trial version to see if that makes a difference. I was using AE CS6. Though I can't imagine that makes a difference.
 
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Hmmm... colorspace issue maybe? your redcode files in resolve are raw, being debayered within resolve.. the dpx files are going to be in a different colorspace, well, different than raw anyway, and AE might be shifting them to a different colorspace when it applies effects.

Interesting issue. Might be worth talking to Adobe about it. Are you unable to correct the warmness out of the roundtripped files back in resolve? If you _can_ you could do that correction on a single node and just copy/paste it to all affected clips.

Rather than going round in circles on it that's probably the route I'd take. *shrug*
 
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Download the trail version of Neat for OFX. It'll only let you work in the lower resolution and see if the problem continues with a different workflow. If it doesn't, it may be worthwhile to dig deep and invest the $199.
 
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What's the plan for export/distribution? If you're going to theatrical district, you'll need 2k output and therefore the paid version of Resolve anyway.

I'm also not really sure why the VFX clips are coming back to you, rather than your colourist to do the final grade/output.

Anyway, I'd probably just correct the warmth out of those specific shots; I assume you're applying the same grade to all, in which case just correct the warmth out, save the grade as a still and then you can apply that same grade to the warmer clips with two clicks.

Otherwise invest in the Neat plugin for DaVinci; it's cheaper than the full version of Resolve
 
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You wouldn't necessarily need the full version of resolve for theatrical distribution. You could export 1080p, then outside of resolve upscale by 4.0625% and crop to 1998x1080.

With imagemagick it would be simply a matter of batching this:

Code: 
convert [input_file] -resize 104.0625% -gravity Center -crop 1998x1080+0+0 +repage [output_file]

Actually, it's even be doable with imagemagick's 'mogrify' command so that it happens in place and you don't end up with two of every frame. In which case you'd batch this:

Code: 
mogrify -resize 104.0625% -gravity Center -crop 1998x1080+0+0 +repage [filename]

Run that through each of the frame image files, and it'll resize to a DCP compliant 2k framesize, then proceed with dcp creation with opendcp. ;)
 
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Will Vincent said:
You wouldn't necessarily need the full version of resolve for theatrical distribution. You could export 1080p, then outside of resolve upscale by 4.0625% and crop to 1998x1080.
Click to expand...

Why upscale when your source is 4k?!

If your source was 1080p, sure you'd need to upscale regardless. But when you're coming from 4k, I can't possibly see why you would downscale to 1080, then upscale again to 2k, for the sake of a few bucks...
 
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jax_rox said:
Why upscale when your source is 4k?!

If your source was 1080p, sure you'd need to upscale regardless. But when you're coming from 4k, I can't possibly see why you would downscale to 1080, then upscale again to 2k, for the sake of a few bucks...
Click to expand...

Depends whether or not you consider a grand a few bucks I guess. :D
 
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Will Vincent said:
You wouldn't necessarily need the full version of resolve for theatrical distribution. You could export 1080p, then outside of resolve upscale by 4.0625% and crop to 1998x1080.

With imagemagick it would be simply a matter of batching this:

Code: 
convert [input_file] -resize 104.0625% -gravity Center -crop 1998x1080+0+0 +repage [output_file]

Actually, it's even be doable with imagemagick's 'mogrify' command so that it happens in place and you don't end up with two of every frame. In which case you'd batch this:

Code: 
mogrify -resize 104.0625% -gravity Center -crop 1998x1080+0+0 +repage [filename]

Run that through each of the frame image files, and it'll resize to a DCP compliant 2k framesize, then proceed with dcp creation with opendcp. ;)
Click to expand...

Another option, if your material is 1920x1080, just leave it as is. You'll end up with 39 pixels of black on either side of the image when projected, but it's not even noticeable.
 
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