So I'm making this post because I'm curious as to your setups on recording audio on the go. I recently got a Behringer C-1 condenser microphone and an audio interface to go with it to plug onto my desktop and it's a great setup but I'm restricted to just my room seeing as the C-1 needs phantom power, which is supplied by my audio interface but it's restrained to being connected to my desktop. I'll either need to figure out a way to achieve portable phantom power and route the mic to my field recorder, or likely invest in some kind of shotgun mic that does not require phantom power. Anyways, I'd like to hear about your setups that work great for your purposes.
Portable audio setup
- Thread starter cochinasanchez
- Start date
Please, please, please...
As always, we need more details. What are you trying to record (Sound FX, dialog)? How much experience do you have (None, a little, some)? What is your budget ($100, $10,000, somewhere in the middle)? What is your field recorder?
1 - the C-1 IS NOT intended for field use.
2 - a shotgun mic is not always the best choice for... Oh, that's right, we don't know what you're recording.
I'll stop here, there are just too many other variables.
For the meantime, here's my $1,200 buying guide.
Shotgun mic kits will have the shotgun mic, boom-pole, shock-mount and simple wind protection (softie).
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/551607-REG/Audio_Technica_AT_875_Shotgun_Microphone.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/461493-REG/Rode_NTG_1_Shotgun_Condenser.html
Hypercardioid mic:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/867157-REG/Avantone_Pro_CK1_CK_1_Small_Capsule_FET_Pencil.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/359043-REG/sE_Electronics_SE1A_SE1A_Small_Diaphragm.html
Audio recorders:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/832911-REG/Tascam_DR100MKII_DR_100mkII_Portable_Linear.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821259-REG/Tascam_DR_40_DR_40_4_Track_Handheld_Digital.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821260-REG/Roland_R_26_R_26_6_Channel_Digital_Field.html
Headphones:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/49510-REG/Sony_MDR_7506_MDR_7506_Headphone.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/507447-REG/Sennheiser_HD_25_1_II_HD_25_1_II.html
You'll also need cables, cases, battery packs and other miscellaneous items - about $200+.
As always, we need more details. What are you trying to record (Sound FX, dialog)? How much experience do you have (None, a little, some)? What is your budget ($100, $10,000, somewhere in the middle)? What is your field recorder?
1 - the C-1 IS NOT intended for field use.
2 - a shotgun mic is not always the best choice for... Oh, that's right, we don't know what you're recording.
I'll stop here, there are just too many other variables.
For the meantime, here's my $1,200 buying guide.
Shotgun mic kits will have the shotgun mic, boom-pole, shock-mount and simple wind protection (softie).
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/551607-REG/Audio_Technica_AT_875_Shotgun_Microphone.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/461493-REG/Rode_NTG_1_Shotgun_Condenser.html
Hypercardioid mic:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/867157-REG/Avantone_Pro_CK1_CK_1_Small_Capsule_FET_Pencil.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/359043-REG/sE_Electronics_SE1A_SE1A_Small_Diaphragm.html
Audio recorders:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/832911-REG/Tascam_DR100MKII_DR_100mkII_Portable_Linear.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821259-REG/Tascam_DR_40_DR_40_4_Track_Handheld_Digital.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821260-REG/Roland_R_26_R_26_6_Channel_Digital_Field.html
Headphones:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/49510-REG/Sony_MDR_7506_MDR_7506_Headphone.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/507447-REG/Sennheiser_HD_25_1_II_HD_25_1_II.html
You'll also need cables, cases, battery packs and other miscellaneous items - about $200+.
Just to follow up...
The above guide is a "basic" entry level prosumer quality kit, meant to be wielded by a dedicated PSM/Boom-op. It is far from definitive, but it's a good place to start. Quite a few of them are IndieTalk Member Tested
. The foibles of all the gear have been discussed frequently.
To indie types $1,200 seems like a huge amount of money; to a professional production sound team that's just one microphone in a kit that can easily cost well over $50,000. It's all a matter of perspective.
Oh, one more thing... Are you an audio guy or are you a video guy mounting the mic to your camera?
The ins and outs of Sound-For-Picture (primarily production sound and audio post) have also been frequently discussed here as well, including resources (books, websites, etc.) if you want to learn more.
The above guide is a "basic" entry level prosumer quality kit, meant to be wielded by a dedicated PSM/Boom-op. It is far from definitive, but it's a good place to start. Quite a few of them are IndieTalk Member Tested
. The foibles of all the gear have been discussed frequently. To indie types $1,200 seems like a huge amount of money; to a professional production sound team that's just one microphone in a kit that can easily cost well over $50,000. It's all a matter of perspective.
Oh, one more thing... Are you an audio guy or are you a video guy mounting the mic to your camera?
The ins and outs of Sound-For-Picture (primarily production sound and audio post) have also been frequently discussed here as well, including resources (books, websites, etc.) if you want to learn more.
I agree. Your choices are a good starting point, but far from ideal. It may be more cost effective to pay for a sound mixer who has their own gear.
For instance, for $400/day, I can get a sound mixer with film experience (Ie. Edward Scissorhands, Cop and a Half) and full gear including a full range of schoeps microphones, as well as a 744t, or 788t, depending on the setup.
For $200/day I can get a sound mixer with a little less experience, who owns a 744t, and a range of higher end Rode microphones.
For $150/day I can get a guy who holds a boom pole and presses record on my Tascam HD P2 with a Rode M3...
I think hiring someone is pretty much always a better option to trying to try purchase everything and have a friend run it.
That's always my first suggestion, which is almost always ignored. My argument is to rent everything; or, better yet, hire somebody who owns it, knows it inside/out and has experience in that particular craft. The whole point is to make a film, not collect prosumer toys that are used without the requisite skills.
But people want answers on equipment, so that's what they get.
sorry for the lack of info. I'm trying to record sound effects mostly. Some sound effects I would need to leave my home in order to record so I'm not looking to record dialogue, scene audio or anything of that sort. I'm trying to gain more experience in sound design. I hope that's sufficient info.
Well, any recording device where you can run an external mic from, that captures 24bit/96Khz or higher would be recommended. Get a decent cardioid mic... DON'T USE A SHOTGUN, IF YOU DON'T HAVE TO. Only time you should use a shotgun mic, really, is if you are trying to capture a single sound source from somewhere you cannot make the mic reach. Most people get this wrong. Shotgun mics are "worst case scenario" solutions. I had a boom op who insisted on using his higher end Sennheiser shotgun mic as opposed to my lower end, Rode M3 cardioid, when there was no reason to use a shotgun, and my footage suffered for it. In the same production, my Rode M3 outperformed his Sennheiser shotgun, in numerous setups. (I didn't invite him back out for the final shooting day, and I ran audio indoors with my own setup and a c-stand.)
For microphones, the Rode M3 offers the best performance at $150 you're going to find.
Get a good boom pole that allows you to run your mic cable through the handle. (You'll thank me for that later.)
I think sometimes this is true, however I've found myself in the market for prosumer stuff because there simply aren't any people in my area who rent their gear or sell their services. I wonder if it's possible to just buy cameras, lenses, etc, use them for the 10 days it takes you to make your film, then return it all for a full refund (minus shipping costs)? If so, that's the way to go, haha
I think sometimes this is true, however I've found myself in the market for prosumer stuff because there simply aren't any people in my area who rent their gear or sell their services. I wonder if it's possible to just buy cameras, lenses, etc, use them for the 10 days it takes you to make your film, then return it all for a full refund (minus shipping costs)? If so, that's the way to go, haha
It is a matter of perspective after all.
No it wouldn't! For sound design work where large amounts of pitch-shifting is going to be applied, sample rates up to 192kHz can be useful (if you're using a high frequency response mic) but if you're not going to be applying huge amounts of pitch-shifting, stick to 24bit/48kHz.
Again unfortunately, this statement is completely inciorrect! There are a number of reasons why shotguns are used beside the scenario where the mic has to be at a distance (out of frame). They are commonly used by professional ADR recordists and by Foley professionals. They are also very handy for recording SFX out doors, where noise rejection is always an important consideration. Cardioid mics are the most common mic type used in the music industry and while they certainly have a place in audio post they are not as commonly used.
You mean Hollywood and quality production and audio post professionals all over the world get this wrong, but by using a cheap general purpose cardioid mic you get it right?
Not really. If you are wanting to record isolated specific sounds outdoors then a shotgun mic would probably be the best choice. If you're recording ambiances, then a stereo mic would be the best choice. A stereo mic or stereo mic setup would also be the best choice for recording something moving in the soundfield, in the case of say car-by's. SFX recordists usually have a wide range of different mics/mic types, to cover all the different scenarios and SFX they may have to record. Presumably you only have the budget for one mic at the moment and therefore we need to know the primary type of SFX you want to record (and where, what type of environment) so we can suggest mics best suited for that particular task.
G
No, it's not... I gave a specific list of questions that you have not answered.
You answered this one.
Yup, this makes a difference.
Mics run from cheap ($50) to really pricey ($2,000+). We need SOMETHING resembling a budget to make suggestions.
Yup, this also makes a difference as to which mic you can get.
+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*+*++*+*
After a 10 day shoot $150/day ($1,500) gets you solid production sound. If you buy your own gear you'll end up with $1,500 of gear you'll use once or twice a year and crappy production sound. Why bother with sound at all if it's not going to be any good?
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No, I mean most people who are not Hollywood, including you, get that wrong. I've worked with guys who've worked on major Hollywood productions who have taught/guided me, and they agree with my opinion, as well as being a major influence on my opinion. As far as using a cheap cardioid mic, I was merely suggesting it since the OP is asking about cost effective gear.
Also, there are numerous blogs / posts by professionals in the industry, which are found by a simple google of "when to use a shotgun microphone" that also agree with me.
For instance...
http://www.filmunderground.com/53/Article/NWFS/Shotgun-Microphones.htm said:
http://www.trewaudio.com/PDF/las_sample_ch5_shotgun_mics.pdf said:
Professionals who are "experts" don't need to go line by line, disagreeing and disparaging others they disagree with. If you'd like, we can talk about this in a PM, so as to not be bashing each other in the forums. Also, I can put you in touch with the industry pros that I know, and you can discuss your opinions with them. I'll let you guys swordfight it out.
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1. I've been on set with a couple of Hollywood productions and have worked on quite a number of film projects with budgets in the $2m-$6m range. 2. I haven't got it wrong, you have. You don't know anything about me or what I've done and you apparently know just as little about audio!
Provide corroboration from just one "Hollywood guy" that a cheap, general purpose cardioid studio mic would be a good option for recording SFX out doors. I'm not sure if the "guys" you're talking about are just scammers, pretending to have worked on major Hollywood productions, while not really knowing anything or you've just misunderstood what they've told you. Either way, your mic advice to the OP was poor.
No, they do not agree with you, in fact they completely disagree with you!
From the trewaudio pdf you linked to: "Shotgun category mics are great for recording effects tracks!", "I use one shotgun mic for over 90% of my recordings". Your quote is taken from the section of an article dealing specifically with long shotgun mics. I totally agree that long shotguns have a specific usage, would often not the best mic choice and as they're pretty expensive they're probably not an option for the OP anyway. However, a short or medium shotgun might be a good choice for the OP, both in terms of price and performance characteristics. Furthermore, neither article which you quoted even mentions the use of general purpose cardioid mics, let alone recommends them in preference to a shotgun! How then do they "also agree with me"?
When one of those "others" is making statements which are completely inaccurate and providing misleading advice to those just starting out asking for help, then yes, I feel I do have to disagree. Why would an "other", who obviously knows little about the subject, try and provide advice in the first place? Why would they then provide inaccurate/misleading advice and make disparaging statements such as "Most people get this wrong"? Why, when confronted, would they then provide out of context quotes when the article quoted does not support their argument? And why would they continue to argue with an "expert"?
The reason I've responded in public is because I believe it's important for the OP to appreciate that your advice is incorrect and therefore doesn't take it! You can put me in touch with the industry pros you know if you like but there probably won't be much point because if they really are industry pros then we'll be at least broadly in agreement.
G
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Actually, what you're doing is taking me out of context as well as a fair bit of trolling. Stop waving your dick around in front of everyone, and contact me behind the scenes.
I won't reply to anything you say if you're going to continue to take only bits and pieces of what I'm saying out of context. I don't have as much time on my hands as a "Audio Post Expert" apparently has.
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Message to the OP...
Everything I've presented here is solely an opinion, based on my experience, FOR CHEAP/BUDGET audio production. You can take it for what it's worth. I'm not a professional audio engineer and I don't profess to be. However, I've done a number of audio mixing and mastering projects for indie projects in my area, http://www.imdb.me/justinrusso. If you truly want an answer, I can get you in contact with people who have much greater credentials than mine, who've worked on Tim Burton films and more... But being that it seemed you wanted everyone's opinions in an "open discussion" setting, that's why I gave mine.
For $150, the Rode M3 will get the job done for you! You listen to a "AudioPostExpert" and they'll only be able to give you expensive advice. Trust me, for getting inexpensive audio, you'll get good audio out of the Rode M3 into a device which captures at 24bit (and 48Khz - 192Khz)
Did you know the "quietest studio mic in the world" is a $220 Rode NT1 and/or Rode NT1A? Yep... and it's a pretty standard microphone you'd find in large studios. Comparable to the $4,000 Neumann U47. You compare, and tell me if you hear a $2,800 difference. https://youtu.be/VnrXFC5Pyhs
...and "AudioPostExpert" is attempting to bash the Rode M3 and discredit my opinion, solely on price.
However, I'm in agreement with AlcoveAudio that your best bet is to hire a true sound mixer with their own gear. You'll get pristine audio, with higher end gear, for the same cost as you spending on Pro-sumer gear and getting "good" but not "best" sound quality.
Everything I've presented here is solely an opinion, based on my experience, FOR CHEAP/BUDGET audio production. You can take it for what it's worth. I'm not a professional audio engineer and I don't profess to be. However, I've done a number of audio mixing and mastering projects for indie projects in my area, http://www.imdb.me/justinrusso. If you truly want an answer, I can get you in contact with people who have much greater credentials than mine, who've worked on Tim Burton films and more... But being that it seemed you wanted everyone's opinions in an "open discussion" setting, that's why I gave mine.
For $150, the Rode M3 will get the job done for you! You listen to a "AudioPostExpert" and they'll only be able to give you expensive advice. Trust me, for getting inexpensive audio, you'll get good audio out of the Rode M3 into a device which captures at 24bit (and 48Khz - 192Khz)
Did you know the "quietest studio mic in the world" is a $220 Rode NT1 and/or Rode NT1A? Yep... and it's a pretty standard microphone you'd find in large studios. Comparable to the $4,000 Neumann U47. You compare, and tell me if you hear a $2,800 difference. https://youtu.be/VnrXFC5Pyhs
...and "AudioPostExpert" is attempting to bash the Rode M3 and discredit my opinion, solely on price.
However, I'm in agreement with AlcoveAudio that your best bet is to hire a true sound mixer with their own gear. You'll get pristine audio, with higher end gear, for the same cost as you spending on Pro-sumer gear and getting "good" but not "best" sound quality.
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Post your credentials so the OP knows your opinion is greater than mine. Not to mention the fact that our opinions don't actually differ that much. You're just choosing to make it sound that way. I know when I've talked to other pros in the industry they don't jump on every little thing I say and act childish about how wrong I am. They handle it like an "Audio Expert."
Take it easy my friend. You're gonna blow a gasket if you keep it up. No one here is so tightly wound as you.