How Much Can You Sell a Low Budget Indie For?

[Lordmanji]

I am currently editing my low budget feature and I am wondering how much films like this - under 100k - can sell for? Should I just sell it to one company to sell it to others or try selling it to others? And what is a good way to sell it? Festivals?

Thanks,

Completely Lost

[Spatula]

Well, one thing I often do is look at this:

http://www.mandy.com/1/film.cfm

Where people list films for sale and info and budgets and such... There's about 12 films in the 50-100,000 range:
http://www.mandy.com/1/film2.cfm?g=&...l=&a=&e=&f=&n=

They have contact details there too- you could actually phone them up and ask them if they've had offers and if so what kind of market it is. Some might blow you off, but I'm willing to bet most would want to talk your ear off about their movies, lol... if someone called me asking about my movies, I'd probably go broke when the phone bill came.

[Blade_Jones]

Stacey Parks' book "the Insider's Guide to Independent Film Distribution" has a page that lists how much is paid by country, although in this economy and 4,000 other releases per year to compete with good luck.

[CeraGraves]

Nowdays the market isn't very good for selling films - your lucky if you make back what you spent. From what I've heard from producers, LionsGate used to give out $50,000 advances, and now they barely even give out $5,000. The straight-to-DVD market has really dried up since there are so many filmmakers nowdays and therefore so much crap that the public got tired of having to sift through it all to find the good stuff, and now there's barely any interested anymore --- it's tough out there!

Five years ago I know some people who made a film for 9,000 and sold it to a distribution company for a little over 30,000 - but, that was 5 years ago. The same distribution company made an offer on a film that the same company made just last year (which is also a much better film, imo) and it was so low that the company turned them down and decided to distribute the film themselves since they would make more money that way--- if you're willing to put in the effort to market it yourself, that might be a better way to go.

[Gonzo_Entertainment]

The straight-to-DVD market has really dried up since there are so many filmmakers nowdays and therefore so much crap that the public got tired of having to sift through it all to find the good stuff, and now there's barely any interested anymore --- it's tough out there!

Yep, I work for the biggest distributor in the country (we don't buy normally buy films, though we have a branch that does) . We are the middleman between the studio or distributor and the retailer. I used to take screener copies home, but now with 8 million low budget, straight to DVD horror films out there, it's not worth the time to wade through 40 of them to find the one that doesn't suck.

[Blade_Jones]

Yep. Gonzo and CeraGraves have pretty much summed it up. In her book Stacey Parks speaks about the over-supply of indie movies that have disrupted the supply and demand curve. It all started with technology: Professional grade equipment getting more and more affordable, beginning with the Cannon XL-1, then HD cameras. Now they've got that Red-1 camera.

I think indie distributors are gonna be dropping like flies soon, as all the Blockbusters close, Internet DVD sales overtake physical store sales, and more and more filmmakers realize that you don't need a traditional distributor to sell your movie online.

[M1chae1]

Indie films are moving the way of self-distribution and internet viewing/sales. It's the way of the future.

[loop_guide]

I recently went through the experience of selling my first low budget indie DIY thriller/sci-fi movie. I was lucky, I made a great deal for the world rights and actually got a solid advance, now the movie "Dark Reprieve", is available pretty much every where in the USA. Amazon, NetFlix, Hollywood Video, Blockbuster, Target, Best Buy, Barnes and Noble, FYE, iTunes, etc etc. In fact my movie has far better distribution in the USA than many other Canadian films costing 10s of millions!

I also made a great sale to Canadian pay TV that covered a substantial chunk of my budget. Since I made the sale myself 100% of the money went to me, that was great and a smart move.

I can tell you it was a tough tough slog, but it worked out very well in the end for me. I should also tell you that I shot on 35mm which made a huge difference when it came to competing against the mountain of DV shot films out there. Before you think 35mm is cost prohibitive, it wasn't for me. I acted as my own DOP and camera operator, plus I used all re-cans (1000' loads), and used a BL3 vs a swanky new 35mm system and only two lenses, a 24mm and an 85mm.

Dark Reprieve also opened the doors to other features for me, this week I have two features in pre-sales at Cannes with two different studios. And this time I am not self financing either one of them Certainly it's a proud moment when you see the posters going out with your name in the directors spot. There is a lot of production work to come, but I enjoy it.

So my point is that even if your first DIY movie isn't a huge hit, it can really open doors to bigger projects. I would not be where I am with the other films had I not made Dark Reprieve.

Also, one huge huge thing affecting the prices of low budget indies these days is on-line piracy. I got a baptism by fire when my movie came out and it showed up on dozens of file sharing sites over night. I have found some sites where Dark Reprieve has been downloaded over 30,000 times!!

As a result of this the market has been totally killed for many DTV movies that lack a name talent in a lead role. Many foreign buyers at AFM for instance pass on 90% of the DTV product they see now because they know that as soon as they release it in their home territory it will be bootlegged, loaded onto the web, and they will lose a fortune in sales. It is a very serious problem and it has driven the prices for indie DTV movies right into the cellar. Any would be filmmaker needs to be aware of this.

The best path forward these days is to make a movie "good enough" for cable TV. They still need product and if the bootleggers steal the movie after it hits the air it's not a problem for you, you will still get paid as per the contract.

But most indie movies are in the DTV category and your checks will be based on the sales your movie makes in the DVD market. And these sales are going to be very small thanks to all the thieves out there breaking the law and stealing movies via the web.

[Tonec1]

Great post

I am currently Producing a British Gangster Thriller.
I have managed to Cast some well known names. 1 which is currently key cast in Ridley Scott's new Mini Series being shown in the US on Fox and the other Cast are current on British TV. This is my first Feature. The Script is cutting edge and it looks visually amazing.
We shot on £6000 as I have managed to put everyone on a backend deal and all locations which look $1 dollars I got as favours Clubs ect.
Just wondered if you could give advice on my next steps, as really found your post informative.

Thanks in advance.

T

Originally Posted by loop_guide

I recently went through the experience of selling my first low budget indie DIY thriller/sci-fi movie. I was lucky, I made a great deal for the world rights and actually got a solid advance, now the movie "Dark Reprieve", is available pretty much every where in the USA. Amazon, NetFlix, Hollywood Video, Blockbuster, Target, Best Buy, Barnes and Noble, FYE, iTunes, etc etc. In fact my movie has far better distribution in the USA than many other Canadian films costing 10s of millions!

I also made a great sale to Canadian pay TV that covered a substantial chunk of my budget. Since I made the sale myself 100% of the money went to me, that was great and a smart move.

I can tell you it was a tough tough slog, but it worked out very well in the end for me. I should also tell you that I shot on 35mm which made a huge difference when it came to competing against the mountain of DV shot films out there. Before you think 35mm is cost prohibitive, it wasn't for me. I acted as my own DOP and camera operator, plus I used all re-cans (1000' loads), and used a BL3 vs a swanky new 35mm system and only two lenses, a 24mm and an 85mm.

Dark Reprieve also opened the doors to other features for me, this week I have two features in pre-sales at Cannes with two different studios. And this time I am not self financing either one of them Certainly it's a proud moment when you see the posters going out with your name in the directors spot. There is a lot of production work to come, but I enjoy it.

So my point is that even if your first DIY movie isn't a huge hit, it can really open doors to bigger projects. I would not be where I am with the other films had I not made Dark Reprieve.

Also, one huge huge thing affecting the prices of low budget indies these days is on-line piracy. I got a baptism by fire when my movie came out and it showed up on dozens of file sharing sites over night. I have found some sites where Dark Reprieve has been downloaded over 30,000 times!!

As a result of this the market has been totally killed for many DTV movies that lack a name talent in a lead role. Many foreign buyers at AFM for instance pass on 90% of the DTV product they see now because they know that as soon as they release it in their home territory it will be bootlegged, loaded onto the web, and they will lose a fortune in sales. It is a very serious problem and it has driven the prices for indie DTV movies right into the cellar. Any would be filmmaker needs to be aware of this.

The best path forward these days is to make a movie "good enough" for cable TV. They still need product and if the bootleggers steal the movie after it hits the air it's not a problem for you, you will still get paid as per the contract.

But most indie movies are in the DTV category and your checks will be based on the sales your movie makes in the DVD market. And these sales are going to be very small thanks to all the thieves out there breaking the law and stealing movies via the web.

[ad2478]

WOW loop_guide your movie was doenloaded 30,000 times.thats great.shwoing worth...and best of luck for your news films.

[loop_guide]

Originally Posted by ad2478

WOW loop_guide your movie was doenloaded 30,000 times.thats great.shwoing worth...and best of luck for your news films.

Ah no it's not great

That 30,000 downloads was on a bootleg site. It's where people upload movies and then others download them illegally for free.

If your movie is downloaded 30,000 times on iTunes, that is a good thing. A bootleg site, not a good thing.

R,

[Spatula]

Out of curiosity, which "Canadian pay TV" did you end up selling your film to?

[loop_guide]

Originally Posted by Spatula

Out of curiosity, which "Canadian pay TV" did you end up selling your film to?

Super Channel. It's on their website now if you want to enter in the title. They aired it about 30 times in Sept/Oct 2008 as well.

R,

[Spatula]

Originally Posted by loop_guide

Super Channel. It's on their website now if you want to enter in the title. They aired it about 30 times in Sept/Oct 2008 as well.

R,

Awesome- I've never even heard of them! 30 times! That's amazing... congrats!

[ad2478]

loop_guide i have few questions if you dont mind.

As you said
this week I have two features in pre-sales at Cannes with two different studios

1) I wanted to know that those studios contacted you or you contacted them?

2) More over the next 2 upcoming films are actually based on your concept (and Idea) or you are just the filmmaker in those projects?

3)The next upcoming films are of Horror Genre or what?

4) As you said about your first movie. I wanted to know who was the distributor or you personally contacted all these amazon, NetFlix, Hollywood Video, Blockbuster, Target, Best Buy, Barnes and Noble, FYE, iTunes, etc etc for your film?

5) My last question. If Dark Reprieve was your first project then why you took the risk of DOP stuff yourself ? I know few people have the ability of being sure to do everything but even when they think like that they have some logic behind it. Why and how you planned to be DOp of the film yourself? Because in the first attempt it is hard to handle CAM, lighting etc....specially in case when they have a indie budget.

Kindly guide me about these questions.


Regards