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watch shades of black

First of all, is the man blind or what? That's what the narration suggests, but then the guy picks up a beer bottle, and proceeds to beat on a computer (that he supposedly can't see) with a baseball bat. Speaking of which, where the hell did the bat come from?!

I'm sorry, but I just don't like this movie. The only good thing about it is the narration. In other words, it should have just been an audio piece. Infact, I think it could have worked brilliantly as an audio-only piece (minus the terrible--in my opinion--music). The bad lighting, acting, props, and props ruined it for me. Did I mention props? That computer looked like the Apple II was stolen from some museum...it obviously wasn't used to make movies...and who sets their computer up on a fold-out card table in front of a door?!

Anyway, it's pretty obvious where I stand on this movie. Please don't take this criticizm as being mean-spirited. I visited your site, and enjoyed Hippie Highway...so I know your company can do better (and has done better) than Shades of Black.
 
In general I'm in agreement with LOGAL L Prod. in that the story was weak enough that when he starts bashing the monitor it just feels scripted and not like it should be happening. He really needs to get more angry in the narration if he's going to do that on the screen.

As for card tables and Apple II's, so is the life of the working or non-working poor. Understanding humanity in all of its societal positions, I think the acting was pretty on target for what you wrote in the script, again though him trashing the monitor just didn't seem to be the fit at that moment in time. Overall it feels like the confusion in Pi, a movie I really didn't like the first time around, and overall it is decent but it could be better.
 
I disagree with both my comrades. I found SHADES OF BLACK to be a compelling story, good enough that I overlooked it's weak points in production design.

The voice over and the performance was good by the actor. The music was moody & appropriate.

Overall, I liked it a lot.
 
sonnyboo said:
I disagree with both my comrades. I found SHADES OF BLACK to be a compelling story, good enough that I overlooked it's weak points in production design.

The voice over and the performance was good by the actor. The music was moody & appropriate.

Overall, I liked it a lot.

How dare you! :D

No, I liked the acting too, but to be honest the narrator's voice is too high and kiddish for me to think this is a guy who is 28 and been through hell. It just sounds too non-tense and pure to be of a guy who is who he says he is. I think the overlooking the mistakes is something you have to do, even watching full length cinema, but especially watching amatuer productions.
 
I like it! Sorry wideshot / logan but i'm going to have to disagree with you guys as well.

On the up side -
I though the juxtapositioning of the 'retrospective' narrative against the angry live action worked nicely. If the narrative was as 'immediate' as the action is might have come across as too single minded and bland. The voice over was well written as well, nice opening, nice metaphors, great conclusion. The story was built up gradually with good timing and without giving too much away and I loved the closing shot of the fireworks.
The intercutting of shots was a really nice narrative engine. The music is a personal opinion thing but in my eyes it worked well with piece!

On the down side -
Production design / Lighting wasn't the best.
There might have been a bit more compositional opportunity than was made use of. In my personal opinion I would have liked to have seen more close ups of the actor etc...
Some parts could have been edited a bit more fluidly.


And for the information of some of the other film critics in the room (if i'm right) the baseball bat came from under the table?

radical!
 
9ap_le.jpg

Haha. Just kidding. :wink:
 
thanks for the thoughts

Thanks for all the thoughts/critisms. This was actually the first thing I ever directed, so I know that its not perfect. But I do want to respond to a few things said.

Logan Leistikow put:
[First of all, is the man blind or what? That's what the narration suggests, but then the guy picks up a beer bottle, and proceeds to beat on a computer (that he supposedly can't see) with a baseball bat.]

-Yes, the main character is blind, but give blind people some credit. They don't go around knocking things over and running into walls all day. The story takes place at the main character's house and he would generally know where things are in there. As for his beer, he would have just gotten that from the fridge, so he would know where he set it down at. Also if you watch closely, after he throws the moniter off the table he sort of misses it with a couple of swings. The actor actually had is eyes closed while we filmed that whole part, so it should be pretty realistic.

[Did I mention props? That computer looked like the Apple II was stolen from some museum...it obviously wasn't used to make movies...and who sets their computer up on a fold-out card table in front of a door?! ]

I do agree that there could have been a much better job done with lighting and props. Lighting I don't have any excuses for, but the computer I can justify. According to the story, the main character had just started to get into doing movies, therefore he wouldn't have had editing equipment yet. The computer was just supposed to be an old computer, not something that he would have edited with. As for having a computer on a cardtable, I just have to say, at the time, that's how my set-up was. I was a poor college student and a crappy computer on a card table was the best I could do.

With that said, thank you Logan for your critism. I've found that I've learned much more through critism than anything nice anyone has said about my work.

Derek
 
two more quick things

two more quick things in response to what people had said.


Wideshot said:

No, I liked the acting too, but to be honest the narrator's voice is too high and kiddish for me to think this is a guy who is 28 and been through hell. It just sounds too non-tense and pure to be of a guy who is who he says he is. I think the overlooking the mistakes is something you have to do, even watching full length cinema, but especially watching amatuer productions.[/quote]


Thanks for the comments, but the main character is only supposed to be about 20, not 28. The story's about someone who is still starting off in life and not being able to turn into the person he'd like to be.


Also not to harp on Logan's comments, but he mentioned doing the piece as audio only. I do think that's an interesting idea, however I wanted to make a connection with the viewer. By that I mean the main character becomes blind and I wanted to audience to think about the possiblity that it could happen to them to. Therefore, they wouldn't be able to watch movies anymore like the one they would be currently watching.

Once again thanks so much for the comments. Please feel free to write anything about the film, both good and bad.

Derek
 
Hey, no hard feelings. It's your art, not mine...I was just giving my take on it. Others liked it, so that's a good sign...just keep on doing your thing and you'll find more people who understand it and appreciate it better than i do.
 
I was gonna post something about the harshness of some of the reviews, but it looks like you guys worked it out.

Let's all try to remember that we are all still in the process of learning our craft. Some are farther along than others, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they are better at it. These should be constructive critiques, not trash talking reviews.

Now, I found the idea of the movie better than the finished project. It is a bit underdeveloped on the directing side. I did find a lot of what the blind man did untrue to what a newly blind man would do. A newly blind man would still be bumping into walls and knocking things over. All in all though it was a good effort.

Poke
 
pokewowplayer1 said:
I was gonna post something about the harshness of some of the reviews, but it looks like you guys worked it out.

Let's all try to remember that we are all still in the process of learning our craft. Some are farther along than others, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they are better at it. These should be constructive critiques, not trash talking reviews.

Now, I found the idea of the movie better than the finished project. It is a bit underdeveloped on the directing side. I did find a lot of what the blind man did untrue to what a newly blind man would do. A newly blind man would still be bumping into walls and knocking things over. All in all though it was a good effort.

Poke
I'm pretty sure you're talking about what I said. I stated that I wasn't being hateful or mean-spirited. I was just sort of being sarcastic, because I thought it would make my argument more interesting/funny. Sorry :blush: . You seem to agree with me anyway :? .

Also, I don't think that I'm any more talented than anyone here (I'm probably the least talented, haha). I don't think that I'm better, or anything. As I stated in my first quote: "I visited your site, and enjoyed Hippie Highway". I DO think that they are talented. I just didn't like this particular movie. It's just my opinion!

Anyway, slmfilms seemed to understand what I said and why. Hopefully readers of my bad "reviews" will realize that when I give compliments, I truly mean them (I hope people are honest about my movies too) :D .

I don't want to drive a wedge between myself and anyone on this site. Please don't think I'm a mean person or that I was being hateful. I like you guys, and think that you are all good people and filmmakers, so forgive me if what I said was recieved badly, but I was just trying to add some humor/emotion to my post O:) .

P.S. I love you.
 
I didn't read your comments as such, in fact I don't see a single trashing review here.

You want a trashing review, you should read the comments from real critics in the paper about million+ dollar budgeted professional films, now that is harsh. "A waste of time and money, two thumbs down" comes to mind.

The purpose of constructive criticism is to show the author that what he/she has done affected us all in different ways, and we all see things in the film that another may not be tuned to see or hear. In that regard, the author can keep this in mind for his/her next film and hopefully fill some of the glaring gaps missed in this first one, to produce a better overall film. The author cannot, I repeat CANNOT, play strictly to the audience, because the ultimate result will always be the same whether catering to the audience or remaining strict to the original vision: you cannot please everyone at once. MAGNOLIA, for example, is heralded by some as one of the best (if not the best) dramatic ensemble piece of all time, others, like Kevin Smith fans, HATE Magnolia and everything it represents. This is exactly what I am saying.

Take the audience's opinions both seriously and with a grain of salt, and recognize good advice or critique when you see it, it can help you make better art. Take no advice and you will constantly be running head first into the same wall throughout your career, "It's brilliant, but I have some major problems with it."

As an artist, we all have to deal with critique for our entire career, and if you think a few guys on a bulletin board is harsh, wait till you get that first review from a "respected" critic who is paid to trash or praise films on a regular basis, and he says you are a no-talent hack with no ability to tell a story and advises the world to skip your film. And then every little critic who admires this critic adopts similar opinions. THAT is harsh, and THAT is real life, that is why you need to hash this stuff out with a knowledgeable audience well before you step into the spotlight and invite everyone and their dog to judge your work. It may not be pretty to read things that are not 100% pleasant about your art here, but its done to help you to understand what we are seeing, what we were expecting, and why/why not you delivered.

My comments of people's films have been honest and true to my heart, I hope everyone can recognize that. If this film blew me away and left me speechless, I would let slm know that. If it make me run to the bathroom to puke, I would let slm know that as well. This particular film has a lot of good things working for it, I just believe it could have been executed better and that is why I let him know that.

In the same note, I think we all understand exactly whom is posting here, amatuers or professionals just beginning their careers and looking to learn and showcase their work on the small level. I believe the natural instinct is to ignore fundamental mistakes because of the low/no budget aspects of the film, nevertheless the goal of most filmmakers is to make at least better low/no budget films, and certainly in most cases, to make astoundingly good budgeted films, if they are given that opportunity. Some day, you will be far from your computer working on a feature and hopefully you would have learned enough from hashing it out on small places like this that the decision making process which is totally filled with pressure, will become easier and more automatic for you based on what you picked up.

If a moderator or mr absent "indietalk" has any problem with that, let me know and this can be the last. Its not like any of us are being paid to spend our precious time here.
 
reviews

Poke said:

"Let's all try to remember that we are all still in the process of learning our craft. Some are farther along than others, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they are better at it. These should be constructive critiques, not trash talking reviews. "

I have absolutly no problem with any of the reviews for this movie. I don't think that they were mean spirited, and although I want people to like my films, I really want to hear what people don't like about them so I can learn from that and make better stuff in the future. In fact I'm glad people said what they did rather than saying nothing. It gives me an honest evalution (ie something other than "its great" from friends and family). As for Shades of Black, I've noticed that some people really like the film, while others really seem to really dislike it. It was never conceived as a film that everyone would like, so I go into things expecting at least some people to really not like it.

However, I do think its important to keep the critiques constructive (which I think they were for this movie). Thanks Poke for looking out for that. I'd hate to see this website end up with a bunch of people just writing stuff like this film sucks and this other films sucks more.

Thanks again for all the comments and for taking time to watch the film.

Derek
 
Hey guys,

Please remember I said that it looked like you all worked it out. I found Logan's initial post to be a tad harsh. I did not censor him or anything, I just reminded everyone that if you have something to say, try and say it as constructively as possible. If slmfilms is okay with what is written then I'm okay with it.

It was just a little reminder.

Wide, I know we don't pay you to be here. I don't get paid to moderate. But as moderator, it is my job (that I accepted) to moderate the members of the site. I saw something that could have been a problem and I made a note. Don't get upset at me for trying to keep the peace, it's my job.

Anyway, I hope everyone here has learned a valuable lesson, Poke is not always right and not always wrong, but he has hairy nipples.

Poke
 
Of course, and we all value what you do. I think now that this site is really starting to bud, we will see much more of artists posting their pieces, and hopefully this lesson will serve as a reminder for all future conversations to come in this sub-forum, the lesson to keep all of the comments respectful and focused being the most important.

I'm a firm believer in the golden rule, and when I show my first stuff here, I expect others would observe this as well.
 
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