I've worked on piddly little things, public access television, student films. But now, I'm looking at something bigger. I have a script. I got good feedback from those reading it, but despite the wonderful feedback, it's about 75% amatuers reading my work, as I really can't afford a script editor. I've done something I didn't really want too, give to a bunch of people to see what they would think, but it's been good feedback. A couple people I thought it was "ok." (ugh!), some people I thought would laugh in my face, didn't. So that's good. So, with the belief in myself that I have a good enough script to warrant being made, I'm moving forward.

I have a collaborator who's helping me plan, and I most likely have a DP. So I'm scratching those two off the list. What is comes down to now, is planning for the months ahead. I'm biting the bullet - I've always been too worried about failing to say "f it" and move forward. Not anymore. Unfortunetly, because I've never done this...I hardly know where to start. I'm looking through this post for advice as to where to start planning, how to properly budget...I have ideas, but I'm not sure what to look at first.

Thanks,
MIKE

I'm doing the same thing this summer. My experience level is probably quite a bit less than yours....

It all started when a pretty good size feature was partially filmed on one of my boats. I got a chance to see the whole thing in action - some pretty large talent was in the flick as well, Paul Walker, Laurence Fishburne, and a couple others.

I've written all my life, so I said - hey - I should make my own movie. Like you, I said I'm going to just do it.

I bounced the idea of a few friends. They asked me, 'what the hell do you know about movies' and 'don't you need to go to film school or something?'

Very good questions. To the first, I said: I've seen a ton of movies. I know what I want to accomplish. To the second, I would say - I spent a week on a major studio feature with A-list talent, and saw the process firsthand. That was my film school

So to tie it all together, here's what I am doing:

1. I will make sure everything I am not knowledgeable about gets farmed out to an expert. Not just a buddy who can do it, an expert. Get a DP that is familiar with the medium you are working with. Get a good sound guy. Get a professional camera crew.

2. Leaving most of the technical aspects to the experts, I'm then free to do my job - creatively shape the film the way I want it to be. I plan on having some serious meetings before filming with these guys. I'll tell them what I am hoping to achieve, see if it can be done, and then leave it to them to make it happen.

I simply can't let my lack of experience prevent me from not doing it. I see it the same as building a house. You meet with the builder / architect, and you tell him: I want the house to look thus and thus, I want my bedroom like this and my bathroom like that. You don't have to be an architect yourself to do this....they'll tell you if you're off base.


This is my approach to the whole thing. Just freakin' do it. When the public finally sees your film, whether it's a festival or theatrical release, they'll judge it. Until then, no amount of well wishers reading your script really has the right to do so.

Mike,

I seem to remember you asking for reading advice in another thread. Did you have anyone who is on this board as a pro or semi-pro read your script? Do you feel you need to, because it sounds like you may still be uncertain.

Go through this board thoroughly, looking for every pre-prod. aspect you can find to aid you in planning. PLANNING IS EVERYTHING. Shoot schedule, strip boards, story boards, location photos, location releases, deal memos, sound and music design... pre-prod. takes ALOT more time than shooting the darned thing. And build POST PROD. into your budget and schedule. You have to have the time/money/skills to edit, etc. built in or you'll hit a big old brick wall after "that's a wrap!"

Finding a good UPM or experienced producer or first AD can be a huge help as well.

BEST OF LUCK MIKE AND ADAMO.

Two very important first steps to generating a workable budget:

A full script breakdown.
A shooting schedule.

Of course it's easier and often better to find or hire an experienced person to do this - but I'll assume that you can't afford a pro UPM and you don't know anyone who will do it for you.

Even if you won't be paying cast and crew there are things that you will HAVE to pay for. So you'll have to start by doing a fill breakdown of your script.
This is where scene numbers come in. Go through your script line by line. Every prop, costume, set dressing, actor, extra, effect, vehicle, location must be accounted for. Again, even if you’re getting the car for Scene 30 free, you need a line item in your budget for the car. You might want to add $20 for gas as a little thank you.

In preproduction, don’t forget things like script copies, the occasional lunch or pizza during meetings. Are you casting? How about a pot of coffee and bottled water for people waiting for their audition. There are so many things needed, the better your prep, the more you anticipate, the fewer surprises you’ll be hit with.

In post little expenses can be overlooked. Will you need to bring back actors for ADR? Where are you going to do the re-recording? Will you provide some bottled water for them? Maybe buy them lunch?

VHS tape for rough cut screeners, DVD media, postage can add up and should be in the budget.

Your shooting schedule.

What is the most efficient order to shoot your movie? Usually by location. Every hour you are packing and unpacking equipment you are not setting up lights or rolling tape and it’s a waste of time. But sometimes you have to “shoot out” an actor who can only give you two or three days.

So break down you script by location, by exterior and interior, by actor, by groups of actors by day and night and then start playing around until you get a day-out-of-days.

Just a start, but it takes a while to do all this work. You'll be glad you did.

Every reply just gets me more excited, and more sure about the fact that I could pull this off. But the issue of never having any of my longer works made (just little skits and things) makes me nervous. I feel almost strange asking this, but if I don't I could be missing out on some valuable feedback. Are there any longtime site veterans or gurus who have the time to read through my work, and talk with me?

Guerilla Film Makers Blue Print (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0826414532/ref=pd_sr_ec_ir_aps/203-6190023-3012747)

Chris Jones who wrote the Guerilla Film Maker's Handbook has just released this which is a book that take you through the whole process. For someone with little to no knowledge it's a great starting point. You have to take some of his suggestions with a pinch of salt: for instance he suggests that film is the only way to go and Avid Xpress the best editing software to use; then you discover the book was sponsored by Kodak and Avid. Apart from those slighlty weird blind spots it's a great book.

I couldn't find it on US Amazon, but I'm sure you order it from a reputable book shop if you give them the title and the isbn (international standard book number)

I also came from the "just do it school". I'm wrapping up principal photography (yes, still wrapping up) now on my first feature. This is mostly a learning thing what to/not to do. I'll gladly share some of my experience with you...ask questions here, I'll respond as I'm sure will lots of the people on this board!

We're starting with an achievable goal...make something feature length that we can submit to festivals. Requirements:
releases signed
completed original story

Everything else we've learned along the way.

"If you want to be a doctor, look before you leap. If you want to be in show business, leap before you look." -- Steven Spielberg

Mike,

None of your longer works have been made - so what? I'm a Yacht Broker. Yes, that's what I do for a living. It's a good job that pays extremely well and gives me time to pursue other interests.

I have no movie experience other than what I wrote in the above post. None of this has prevented me from moving forward.

I'm sure some one with experience will look at your work, but do you really need an outside party to validate your material? If you're looking for someone to edit your script or check your format that's one thing. If you are looking for someone to tell you "Yes, that will be a great movie" you're not going to get it. If they concur with your script, it's only one man's opinion. If they think it stinks the same applies.

Imagine for a minute someone pitched you a little independent film idea. They said it was going to be called Napoleon Dynamite. It's about a quirky teenage kid in rural Idaho, and his various adventures with his nerdy brother and weird uncle.

Would you buy that flick? Would you even tell the guy it's a good idea, or it had potential? Probably not. From the description, it stinks. I bet the script is even uninspiring without all the visual imagery. You know what? that was a great little movie that has gone on to make money. Who woulda thunk it?

YOU are the SELF in self confidence. Just do it!

Mike, I sent you an email a little bit ago. Please advise if you received it.

Adamo, I have gone the same route. I made my first short knowing VERY little about anything but what I wanted to put on screen. I spent the next three years working on others' shorts and features to learn as much as I could. Now, I am producing a feature (minidv) with a whole slew of experts at the various helms.

A lot of hutzpah goes a long way if you are committed and of nimble mind. There's a lot to pick up in this business and the learning curve can be way harsh. Just keep your head down and keep moving forward.

Oh, and having a lot of money doesn't hurt. ;) (j/k)

Mike, did you know your website is down? :(

I'd be glad to help any way I can.

I'm sure some one with experience will look at your work, but do you really need an outside party to validate your material?

Well, no. I'm more in a "get feedback/advice" and more forward from there type of situation. I like a couple other people look at my work and get their opinions.

I know I'm going to make this happen, I've already made up my mind about that. I just want to know if anyone can give me a little assitance or just a couple tips along the way.

we're here for you...ask the questions as they come up.

What Knightly said....

I can offer very limited advice but ask away....

I am producing a feature (minidv) with a whole slew of experts at the various helms.

:(


Umm, Christine, this is not my film is it? :) Cause we are not shooting on miniDV :)

Johnny

It's been said by others, but never by me (though I have thought it)

You all rock.

So basically, where I stand is this.
I have my script. I have one person who's decently talented already working with me and my DP to bust out storyboards. Unfortunetly, my DP has said while he is interested, he's yet to commit. However, that decision is coming soon he said.

I've got my list of locations and I'm going to start hunting soon. I'm gonna start working on props and costumes next, but that should be pretty easy, as nothing is too extravagant.

After I get locations agreed upon, storyboards situated, I plan on busting out a filming schedule, then casting. That way after casting I have a tenative schedule made already, and it should only need to be adapted.

I have a few sticking points. The settings in my script are easy enough to lock down, except for one, and it is a doozy. I'm trying to budget, but I'm still in the early going of that. I'm looking at on-set food for cast/crew costs, travel costs (both for on-the-road taping and in case anyone has to drive too far to come help, toss them some gas money), festival entry costs. There's the issue of permit costs, but I haven't got my locations scouted yet, so that has to come later. Then, in post there is the issue of music costs. I'm a poor man working on his first independent, I'm not able to go crazy. But I don't even know where to start looking for music royalty costs.

I told you all before, I'm going to be checking back here for advice and tips a bit....am I forgetting anything? Any glaring omissions or mistakes sticking out? I think I'm ready to press forward.

am I forgetting anything

Insurance and contracts (The two expenses you can't by-pass in feature production)

Insurance because the risk of getting sued is real, contracts because you can't sell your film without them.

What is the location that's a doozy?

Insurance and contracts (The two expenses you can't by-pass in feature production)

Insurance because the risk of getting sued is real, contracts because you can't sell your film without them.


Where could I look into taking out insurance on my production?
And in contracts, I'm assuming you mean for the people involved with the production? I've taken some things off of this site, the form for people to sign who appear on camera for example.

And Adamo, the location I need is an arena. It doesn't matter how big (of course in my dreams I have a
huge packed arena, ha.) but I'd settle for a lot less.

MIKE

An Arena...wow. I would definately look to a school for this. My Kid's school out here in CA has a very impressive set of bleachers for their footbal field. The right camera angles could make it look like an arena, and the shool routinely rents it out for various events.

That's the road I'd go down.

Also, A reall good book to get is by Greg Goodell, called independent feature film production. Besides budgets and various other real important info, it contains sample contracts you can use.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0312181175/102-9013765-7005714?v=glance&n=283155

No afiliation...

I can't advise you on insurance because you're not in the UK.
But here is a list of paperwork that you'll need that I've pasted from the Customflix free guide to distribution; it's about the deliverables you need to have at the end of your feature:

Other Deliverables for Self and Traditional Distribution

Deliverables are what a filmmaker needs to give the distributor or buyer to make the sales contract effective. This is your end of the deal. It's more of a burden for those entering into studio-backed arrangements, where the legalities of the business are very specific, but even a supposedly-simple, self-distributed, home video deal can find you searching old files and spending some money. In order from cheap-and-easy to costly-and-time-consuming, be prepared to ante up any or all of the following:
Copy of the shooting and/or production script. Some distributors may want the shooting script; some will want the production script.
Dialogue sheets. Necessary for foreign sales, a word-for-word transcription of all the spoken language (dialogue and voice-over) as it appears in the final version of your film.
Music cue sheet. A listing of each music cue used throughout the project, with accompanying song titles, duration of the cue in minutes (in tenths of seconds), artists performing the music, and publishers (BMI, ASCAP). Music cue sheets are necessary for television sales, as broadcasters and cablecasters maintain licensing deals with the music publishing companies to pay royalty use rights.
Trailer. Hopefully you've created one for promotional purposes before this point.
Production stills. Discussed previously.
Poster, one-sheet, postcards and other marketing materials should be considered. This is very dependent on the kind of deal you are entering or the type of self promotion you are planing. Those signing with studios and large independent distributors won't need these items. Small, direct-to-video and English-speaking foreign buyers may stipulate such materials as necessary to the agreement. Self-distributors should be well-prepared with these items if they are essential to their marketing and promotional plan.
M&E tracks. Music and effects tracks involve separating every single sound effect and music cue on an audio track separate from the dialogue in a production. This is used in foreign sales, when your dialogue will be dubbed into another language.
Copyright. Most independent films are uniquely created, thus the sole property of their creators. If that's the case, be sure you properly register your film with the U.S. Copyright office.
Clearances/releases/insurance. You'll need releases, errors and omissions insurance, contracts for use, and clearances from everyone and everything that appears in your film. From the strip mall parking lot that served as a set to your Uncle Louie who played a character to the local band that provided background music, get signed agreements stating your intentions to promote and sell (and profit from) the movie. "This is essential," says Emma. "A film cannot ultimately be distributed without proper clearances." Though errors and omissions insurance is not an immediate concern, filmmakers should budget for the expense at the outset of the production. Have an attorney (preferably one associated with entertainment law) check out everything to be sure it's kosher.

I know this seems like an additional burden, but it's better to know this before you film rather than after when it all becomes harder work and can potentially prevent sales.

I really recomend reading all of this guide, you can sign up for it here

customflix distribution (http://www.customflix.com/Producer/DistributionTips.jsp;jsessionid=aznKfxiGdga4)

You know, someone brought up the high school football field earlier to me as well, I should probably look into that.

And Clive - Thank You much.

Oops. Sorry Johnny. Due to migraine induced idiocy, I did say that. I have no idea why. I am producing a feature this summer (not minidv!!!)

Mike, I will get back you with that script coverage- do I have a deadline?

btw- Mike, there are many great composers who are looking to get their start just like us. They are willing to work for free or really cheap! I just secured a great pop ballad for the end of "Rubble" from a UK artist, just by asking!

Mike, I will get back you with that script coverage- do I have a deadline?

Nothing too pressing, I'm trying to start heavy planning and plotting in about two weeks, right now I'm just getting feedback on the script, and seeing how many people are interested in being involved. Luckily so far, feedback has been positive. I need to work on my professional formatting/style a bit I think (expected, since it's my first feature script) but everyone's said it is funny. Which is important when, y'know, try and write a comedy.

So I got that going. :)

Oh and on a side note, you were wondering about my website. It was either "scrounge funds now and try to keep it going," or "wait two weeks, let it go down, then just pay for a full year when I have real money again." I opted for the latter.

It’s much easier to get people to commit when you have an actual start date. This is YOUR project - you’re sticking with it as long as it takes. Very few people are willing to commit to working on your a movie that you HOPE will start shooting soon.

Since you are still working on the script it might be several months (if not years) before you actually need to hire a DP. You'll will get many more people interested when you can say, “I start shooting in six weeks. The insurance is paid for, the locations secure and I have my first audition tomorrow. Will you be available?”

Insurance? Check:
http://www.productioninsurance.com/
http://www.filmemporium.com/newweb/insurance/index.htm


Just a little side note: Sometimes it’s best to do your big movie second - after you’ve finished a small one. A movie that needs an arena is a huge burden for a first feature. Have you considered doing something smaller as your first project? Something with five to seven actors and only five or six locations?

While I've never done anything technically as a" film", I've been doing a public access show for a couple years, producing short skits of varying length (3-20 minutes), and of varying quality (from Super 8 to high-quality Mini DV shorts), and I just feel like doing something big now after all that. From doing the show I have a crew of people that are interested in working on this project.

I agree, and am very nervous that I am setting my sights too high for my first venture into the "let's try and make something REAL" area. If I could get your e-mail I'd love to send you a copy (if you are willing of course) just to see what you think of things. That arena scene is pretty big scale, but what's nice is that the rest of it isn't. I think if I can just swing a few things in the right direction, I could make it happen.

*crosses fingers.*

and thanks for the insurance links!