Online at last!

It still needs a wee bit of colour correction (and as usual, a redub of dialogue), but I am very happy with my very first film on Super-8. Much different from video, for sure.

This was made primarily as a test of my beautiful, sexy Canon 814 AZ. Learned many things along the way, including the massive differences in colour saturation, working manual exposures on delicate film... and other things that will be on top of a checklist to look for the next time we use real film. :cool:

Some of the extreme closeups came out blurry... first and last time I ever mess with the diopter after the DP has set everything up perfectly. Sorry Flaviu.. my bad. :blush:

Why is it called "Trunk Fiction", you may ask? I just needed to use that patented Tarantino trunk-shot.

Anyways... enjoy. :cool:


Windows Version Here - 15 MB (http://www.zenweasel.com/ifilm/trunk_fiction_02.wmv)



QuickTime Version Here - 45 MB (http://www.zenweasel.com/ifilm/trunk_fiction_02.mov)


http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/poster_01.jpg

Pretty good stuff Zen. Like you mentioned, the sound has issues, and the actors readings were pretty stiff.

Nice twist, and good looking film.

Poke

any chance of a qt version?

Thanks for the reply, Poke :cool:

the actors readings were pretty stiff

I agree, yes. This was part of the learning process, mind you.

I bought 10 rolls of film for this. Unlike video (where one can re-use the same tape over and over, if running out) I had no idea how long the film would realistically last. In trying to conserve my limited film supply, most of the shots were single takes... or second takes, if not good enough the first time.

At the end of the day, we had used 4 of the 10 rolls, total. Looking back, I can see I could have been far less frugal with the shots. I was just mortified that we might run out of film cartridges before getting every scene. I feel more comfortable with ratios now. :)

the sound has issues

Aside from the actual dialogue (with all that extra noise going on in the background), how is the foleyed sound? (birds chirping, car noises, etc)

Nice twist

Very interested in this. I was thinking that the flick may have been too hard to follow (especially as the trail looks more like motor oil than blood, before upcoming colour fixing).

You were able to follow the suggested storyline okay?

and good looking film

That's all Flaviu's work. :yes:

You don't want to see what it looked like, when I was using the camera. :no:

It was a first time for all of us, using real film. Can't wait to do it again.

any chance of a qt version?

I shall upload a QT version in the upcoming day, Lux. :)

maad thanks

Zen--awesome! Congrats on your first "FILM!" Its good to see that you were able to get it done and online, especially while you are likely also working on a different one for the competition. I agree that there was a bit too much sound fluctuation when diaglogue occured, but I thought the sound was otherwise okay. As for the trail of liquid, I think it still looks a little like motor oil but the first few lines of dialogue clearly establish what's going on...I don't think there is any confusion about the story. Thanks!

Zen,

The sound issues I was referring to was with the dialogue. The other stuff sounded good. So good in fact that I think it made the dialogue portions stand out.

I followed the story easily. It's pretty obvious the implications when you have the woman get all wide eyed when she sees the guns. I did see it coming though. I think the some of the lines made it too obvious that they were not saying it was a person in the trunk. Does that make sense?

Poke

EXCELLENT short! It's good to see Super 8 is not a forgotten format. :D

Nicely done as a first super 8 film. A few things out of focus. Also, at first, you couldn't tell the leak was supposed to be from the trunk. You needed (in my opinion) to show the back of the car in the shot where it was dripping from the trunk. It just looked like a puddle on the ground near where they were parking.

Good job Zen. Break the super 8 out again!

Is good to hear the setup for it wasn't too confusing. :)

You needed (in my opinion) to show the back of the car in the shot where it was dripping from the trunk

We actually had those shots lined up to do.

We attached a hose to the trunk, and wound it around the side of the car and through a window, where a pressurised tank of blood would squirt it out. Unfortunately, when it was time to do that actual scene... the on/off control handle was smashed when David climbed into the car and closed the door on it. Oops

We kinda had to fake it from there.

Here's what the simple rig looked like.

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/bts_hose_01.jpg

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/bts_hose_02.jpg

...and here is our DP Flaviu about to discover that I was messing with the diopter when he wasn't looking. :cool:

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/bts_flaviu.jpg

Nice Steve! I have it saved on the computer. ill watch it again later on today. :)

Great film! I loved it...
I found near the end a bit of quicker cutting could have saved the acting a bit, but that didn't stop me from laughing outloud. Great job- loved the ending, lol.

Can't wait to see you competition piece...

-Logan-

Zen bravo on getting the film in the can and all finished up. :clap:

I really liked how it all came together. This was a first step and from here you can go on and improve. Looks so great shot on film. :yes: I really like seeing those BTS pics, post more if you got some. ;)

i'm not so sure tarantino can really be credited with the trunk shot. I'd like to think Alex Cox and Repo Man hold that title but thats just a stab in the dark. Either way i'm looking forward to seeing this thing.

Thanks for the addititional feedback people. :)

I really like seeing those BTS pics, post more if you got some. :)

David Ament is addicted to his palmcorder when not actually onsceen. I have a copy of that tape (where I'll be nabbing more bts shots from), and apparently he's going to try his hand at editing all his footage into a bts video of some kind.

near the end a bit of quicker cutting could have saved the acting a bit

Actually, this is exactly what I was thinking while uploading this. Initially the idea was to have the longer pauses to magnify some kind of tenseness between the two... in retrospect I can see it did not work as well as I imagined. I'll be trimming a bit more out.

i'm not so sure tarantino can really be credited with the trunk shot

While he may not have been the first to do it, Tarantino is the contemporary that this generation recognises for it.

In my opinion, a lot of what Q does is not very original... and he readily talks in interviews about how he lifts ideas and more from a massive selection of films to give style to his own creations.

Good call on Repo-Man, though.

It's good to see Super 8 is not a forgotten format

While not forgotten, it still needs more love... and I'll be providing it.

It was very exciting to be asking everyone I knew if they had ever workd on film before... all replying "No"... and saying that that was as good an excuse as any to go ahead and try it. :cool:

_______

Btw, the link for the QuickTime version has been edited into the original post, for you wacky MAC people.

I should also mention that many of the crew and cast (all extremely talented, I might add) follow the threads here. If anyone has any questions for (or about) any of them, please ask away. After all, they are the ones that really make it all happen.

Zensteve - Nice short film! Super 8 is definately the way forward!... one question? did you get it properly telecinéd or did you just shoot video at a projected image?

Tarantino and the trunk shot... well considering tarantino has nicked just about everything he's ever shot he'd be a bit hypocritical telling you off for using it! LOL!

Film - perhaps the cutting could have been a bit slicker... the dialogue seemed to have long pauses. Also - what did you record the sound on - it might have been better to do sync sound with a boom and a mini disc recorder rather than onto super 8 if that's what happened. Rock on! keep it up!

Rock on Super 8.

Shot? Where you been?

Poke

It's been a long time coming poke. But I'm back... I had a busy period of film making :( But it's all over now! Back to the desk and back to indietalk! woohooo!

Also recently - film school has been on my case all the time. Indie talk is so big now! :O way to go indie - you've got yourself an empire - I guess moderating is a full time job poke!

Long time, no see Nathan!

did you get it properly telecinéd

I had it done with a film-chain transfer. Not sure if it was one-light or best-light. Forgot to ask.

might have been better to do sync sound with a boom and a mini disc recorder

Actually, we had a boom-mic running to a PD-150. In theory it could have been a lot better... I am just the master of messing up sound. If there's a way to screw it up, I'll find it. :cool:

I'm seeing the two with dialogue this weekend... I'll ambush them to redub their lines then.

Indie talk is so big now! :O way to go indie - you've got yourself an empire
:welcome: back Nathan!

Steve
Hey Buddy, I just want to say thank you for all the fun we had filming Trunk Fiction.
And I look forward to start filming again with you here soon. I just hope you dont have me cut my hair again ( lol ) Man...... all that long hair I had in trunk Fiction is all gone. But thats cool, ( just kidding )

Hey there, Mikel, and welcome to IndieTalk :cool:

Don't go spilling the beans about our ITOOFC #3 entry, mister. That's still :secret:

Up for some redubbing Sunday? Excellent. :)

Did you remember to save all your hair-clippings, so you can sell them on E-Bay when you get famous? :lol:

Hey Steve,

Awesome to see a cut with audio!

Hope you'll someday forgive me about the focus issues... :(

Hope you'll someday forgive me about the focus issues... :(

Not your fault, Flaviu.

I was clueless about the personalisation of the eyepiece diopter... I must have re-adjusted it a dozen times after you were all set up. :blush:

You did a wonderful job; especially being our first time on real film... and for the awful hours I called the shoot-time for. (You've seen my takes... almost pure white exposure) :lol:

Don't be beating yourself over some experimental shots on a new format. You are an excellent DP. :cool:

So what's the next super 8 film Zen? After the success of the last one you've got a hearty eye's peeled audience awaiting further productions!

I was thinking the other day. I wonder if there's every been made a camera - in the dark distortion of history - that has been able to shoot Super 8 Vistascreen style - in other words, take the film stock through a very wide gate from side to side rather than from top to bottom... if there's never been one - TRADEMARK! it's my idea ;) mwahahahaa... but seriously, vistascreen super 8... hmmmm....

Steve, you're too nice!

I'll bring over the footage for the other...oops...I've said too much! :D

Hey Zen,

Nice short you've got there :D. I liked the beginning quite a bit. The homeless dude was awesome!

The dialogue towards the end was slightly stilted. I think this is mostly due to the editing though. I'm blanking out on the term at the moment, but you may want to incorporate edits that don't include cutting back and forth for lines of dialogue if that makes any sense. Egh, I need to go dig up that term.

EDIT: Ok, here we go! Split Edits, J-Cuts, and L-Cuts; all of which are very similar in nature. May be something to look into.

J/Ls would be nice to do, yes, but due to the way I had it shot I can't do that. That extra "reaction" footage just isn't there.

It's a non-sync camera, as well... sound starting drifting wildly after 20 seconds, so it really wasn't feasible to do long complete scenes from one certain angle.

That was also rough on the actors, who basically had to break character every 10 to 15 seconds for a new angle setup.

I learned a lot from shooting this though... and many of the lessons I got from this were incorporated into how my ITOOFC #3 entry was shot.

I've started re-editing the parts with dialogue to make the cuts snappier. Almost everyone agrees the pauses are too long.

:cool:

Understandable :). I'm looking forward to your ITOOFC entry! Is it (going to be?) shot on Super 8 as well?

Steve,

You are Plotting an Ambush on Dave and I. Iam so shocked. ( LOL ).

Steve,

naaaaaaaaaaaaa. I wont spill the beans. I still want to work for you on other jobs.

Here's a few more stills.

Here's my reaction when everyone suddenly asks when they're being paid...

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/steve_panic.jpg


...and here is Flaviu moving into his new apartment, after discovering there is no pay.

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/flaviu_trunk.jpg

...and here is Flaviu moving into his new apartment, after discovering there is no pay

When can I move in Steve? May is almost over and I can't pay my landlord in short films!

Thanks for the suggestions and input people. :)

I've eliminated 19 seconds of pauses, and replaced the file in the original post with the newer cut. (It's also half the size it was)

I still need to work on colour a bit (and get the two fellows to redub their lines).

I really appreciate the feedback I get from IndieTalk, as I muddle my way through the process. :cool:

WOW! The cuts really make it 200% better.
I didn't mention it before, but I love the use of mirroring when they go to the trunk.
The cuts really did a lot here- it looks amazing! Good job!

-Logan-

Here's a few more stills.

Here's my reaction when everyone suddenly asks when they're being paid...

http://www.zenweasel.com/trunk/steve_panic.jpg


Classic! :lol: That's normally the reaction my face is in when I get that question. Going to go DL the new cut now.

Although the performances suck, it was shot pretty well and the lighting looks good.

It could use som ADR though, otherwise, well done!

Although the performances suck...

Do we really have to say it that way? Let's try to keep our criticism constructive.

Poke

I'm not judging the filmmaker, I felt the film was well done. But constructive criticism should only be given where it's due, if you're offended by me saying that a performance sucked just be glad that I wasn't more eloquent in my opinion. If you don't want brutal honesty, then this is the wrong business to be in.

Anyway, Steve, I look forward to whatever you decide to create with those 6 extra reels!

I thank you for the positive comments, Loyfilms, however...

constructive criticism should only be given where it's due

...I do not agree with this.

Knowing why something didn't work is far more valuable than just knowing that it didn't.

A few people above mentioned that they felt the actors delivered the dialogue in a "flat" and "stilted" fashion. That's something I can then look at. As it turns out, I agree with their judgement. Since both actors are coming by today to ADR anyway, I've been able to talk to them and give them a chance to rehearse a few variations of the take. I have been able to fix a problem.

A few other people mentioned that they felt the acting was coming across as stiff, with the long pauses I had them take. Once again, that is something I can work with. I was able to look at what they were talking about and make any changes based on their feedback. As it happens, I also agreed that (while it seemed a good idea at the time) the pauses were far too long and handicapping the actors. A few timeline edits in Premiere and I had improved the situation... with the new cut uploaded for a new assessment.

Those are two examples from this thread alone, where boardmembers have been generous enough to say what they did not like... and why. In both situations I have been able to make improvements, since I then knew exactly what they were talking about.

It's a lot more difficult to do the same with generic, blanket statements. Clearly you think the actors blow... but why? Is it something I can fix in an edit? Does one of them have bad breath? Are they ugly? They should have been speaking in French accents, whilst wearing berets?

Maybe it's not even the actors themselves, and it's director himself who needs a suggestion on how to have made it work better? (This is actually a possibility, as they delieverd it all pretty much spot-on as how I wanted them to do it)

Even if it's not something I can fix with an edit this time around, just knowing what to keep an eye out for next time around is invaluable in itself.

After all, this is a filmmaking board... not some 'net entertainment portal like IFilm, or the like. If you have to get a little "eloquent" in why the actors didn't work, I would hope you would do so. It's certainly something I would read and consider... I've already demonstrated that I listen to what my peers have to say, and have made decisions about re-edits based upon their input.

Even better than breaking down the "why they didn't work" into details, is possibly offering a different take on how it might have worked. :)

Anyways, I've rambled on long enough.

Cheers,
Steve.

Actually, I always look forward to getting constructive critisicm. It's my favorite part to see how people react. It's always a learning experience, and you can only get better if people are honest and precise in thier critiques.
Getting a "My vaccuum called, it wants it's sucking back" comment only hurts people's feelings! If you can properly explain WHY your vaccuum has access to a telephone and HOW it lost it's suction, then everybody wins!
I can't wait to get critiques on my entry to the contest here... hopefully they are harsh, there's no way I'll give up, so I might as well get a good punch to better my tolerance!

-Spickula-

Getting a "My vaccuum called, it wants it's sucking back" comment only hurts people's feelings! If you can properly explain WHY your vaccuum has access to a telephone and HOW it lost it's suction, then everybody wins!
:rofl: perfect!

It's important to remember that this is a board of filmmakers helping filmmakers. Films are not posted here for Ebert style reviews. Films are posted here to get feedback from other filmmakers.

Poke

Hey Steve, I never meant any disrespect. I had already read the thread and felt there wasn't anything more to say about why the acting was bad, I just simply agreed with them without using the phrase "I agree with the previous postings"

Anyway, let's move on

I can't wait to get critiques on my entry to the contest here... hopefully they are harsh

:yes:
waiting....

Great film! I have nothing to add in terms of criticism that hasn't been said already, but I just wanted to say that I enjoyed watching it.

Was it chocolate milk? Good little film Steve. I hope you didnt rent that car. LOL

No worries, Loyfilms :)

It's actually a one gallon jug of hot-sauce, Mr Fish. That's something else I learned... all shades of red came out rather dull & muted (and a lot darker) on K-40 film. It's something I'll be watching for, next Super-8 flick. :cool:

I had several layers of plastic sheeting inside the trunk, then loaded up the groceries on that... poured half a gallon of hot-sauce all over the place, then buried the rest of the jug in the middle. It was tilted to keep pouring out when in place. (and after it was all removed, the only stain I found was the size of dime) :yes:

Thanks for all the comments, people. I'm happy that you have taken the time to watch.

Oh... and the new new cut (with ADR'd dialogue) will be up this coming Sunday.

Okies, re-edited original post to pop in the latest incarnation... which has the cleaned-up sound. :cool:

Thanks one and all, for the suggestions on how to improve it... and what to keep in mind for the next time.

:P

Thank you for the Quicktime version, good sir! Downloading now...

I should have a DVD for you by this weekend, good sir... including the raw 'cines footage.

Good for the reel, etc. :cool:

Mmmm....sexy!

Great work Zen I finally checked it out. It looked clean.

There's now an iPod version of this floating about here...
http://www.flaviuman.com/trunk_fiction.html