View Full Version : looking for a cover of people are strange


maxham
03-27-2010, 06:03 PM
For the begining of my documentary I require a cover of the song "people are strange" by the doors. I am not able to pay much right now but if I could get it for free that'd be great if not I can work something out. If anyone is willing to do so that'd be in my best interest.

Dreadylocks
03-27-2010, 07:06 PM
Do you have the rights to the song or is it in public domain?

I think my bf would do it (he loves that tune and already knows it) but I don't think he'd want to have his voice attached to something infringing copyright. It could hurt future prospects, you know?

polfilmblog
03-27-2010, 08:07 PM
Without the rights, you'd be in trouble down the road. Even for covering it.

maxham
03-27-2010, 08:27 PM
Really? People cover songs all the time without trouble and in a small film as long as I'm not stealing the original song without permission there shouldn't be any legal problems.

Zensteve
03-27-2010, 09:12 PM
Really? People cover songs all the time without trouble

Bands that cover songs, without trouble, are the bands that take care of few things... like licensing.

Just because a band has a license to cover certain songs does not mean they also have the right to license off their own version. They *may* have that right... if that's what they negotiated & payed for with whomever they were dealing with.

It's up to you to make sure that they do, and that you have the paperwork to prove it.

You can even go directly to ASCAP & BMI and do rough calculations on what licenses you need (and how much they cost). There's more than one license, btw.


in a small film as long as I'm not stealing the original song without permission there shouldn't be any legal problems.

That's so cute. http://zenweasel.com/images/smilies/smiley_keke.gif

Why are you making a film, if you are hoping that noone sees it?

If your film is going to be a small project that noone ever sees (personal demo-reel, an editing exercise, film for the 3 people in film club) then sure... odds are good that it will slide.

The minute someone starts paying real attention to it (and people are talking about it), you'll be finding out why it's better to take care of the legal details up front.


The Doors probably ain't gonna be cheap (even a cover version), but there's no shortage of musicians out there with a similar sound & similar songs who write their own material, and who would love to have their material placed in a film... and who'll give it away for free.

maxham
03-28-2010, 09:31 PM
I'm going to have to look into that full throttle then.

Gonzo_Entertainment
03-29-2010, 11:05 AM
Really? People cover songs all the time without trouble and in a small film as long as I'm not stealing the original song without permission there shouldn't be any legal problems.

The bars where bands play (sang in a band for 20 years) pay a fee to BMI and or ASCAP (you'll sometimes see the sticker on the door) that covers the rights to perform cover songs in public in that bar. If they record it and release it on an album they have to acquire the rights from the publisher to be "legal".

maxham
03-30-2010, 01:44 AM
damnit nothing is ever simple....lol

ROC
03-30-2010, 02:24 AM
Here's a favorite quote by Randy Thom from a Sound Design forum:

"...this issue reminds me of is what I call the "just tell me the secret" phenomenon. Many of the posts on forums like this one are from novices who think, or hope, that for every one of the problems they encounter in recording, fabricating, and processing sound there is a SECRET trick solution, known only by the clan of audio gurus. What is the magic mic position which gets rid of clicks? What is the secret to getting rid of distortion and ambient noise? What is the plug-in which will turn my dog's growl into a T-REX scream? The answer is almost always that there is NO simple way to do any of these things. The answer is inevitably lots of hard work and lots of experimentation."

So, hope you can write music! :)

Zensteve
03-30-2010, 02:33 AM
nm

directorik
03-30-2010, 11:49 AM
We got into this discussion of simple or not just
a little while ago. It got pretty heated.

To me, copyright is very simple. You need permission
from the copyright owner to use their work. I see
nothing at all complicated in that. Regardless of what
others have done or what one thinks might be legal,
the owner of the copyright must give permission.

Mystonic
03-31-2010, 08:54 PM
what is the purpose of the film?
are you making a silly video for your youtube page?
are you making a actual movie to submit to industry?

these things matter, because there are like 50 covers of people are strange up on youtube RIGHT NOW that don't have any licensing rights with the copyright holder, and they can NOT be taken off of youtube with existing law. you need to put it in perspective, as to what you are doing. to just use a blanket statement and say if you are making a home movie or something for a school project you need to buy the rights and get permission, then you are just being foolish, and not using your brain, and it is one of the main reasons the industry as a whole gets no respect anymore.

this will be very expensive if you elect to go legit and try and pay for it, does the name lost boys mean anything to you? mega blockbuster film, which used the cover of this on their soundtrack. that should tell you something.

and yes, if you do this legally, as in if you are planning to put it out to the industry, (not youtube - NOTHING CAN LEGALLY BE DONE TO YOU TO USE A COVER SONG ON ANY YOUTUBE VIDEO) but above youtube, you are required to provide a small payment to the copyright holder on the basis of the estimated audience, and that's if it is approved in the first place. it is not comparable to getting a mechanical license to cover a song for just release for individual sale. (this can't be blocked, and is a legally established rate.)

maxham
04-01-2010, 11:35 AM
Well I am certainly planning on more than just youtube. I wouldn't bother otherwise. But as long as the band has a liscense for the song and they allow me to use it with permission I should be legally covered. And yes I know lost boys used a cover of the song. They probably had to buy the rights though. Although I don't know how Morgan Spurlock (super size me) got the rights to the Queen song "fat bottomed girls" in his movie. He must have more money than I think he does (before super size me he must have had a good amount).

directorik
04-01-2010, 12:04 PM
Well I am certainly planning on more than just youtube. I wouldn't bother otherwise. But as long as the band has a liscense for the song and they allow me to use it with permission I should be legally covered. And yes I know lost boys used a cover of the song. They probably had to buy the rights though. Although I don't know how Morgan Spurlock (super size me) got the rights to the Queen song "fat bottomed girls" in his movie. He must have more money than I think he does (before super size me he must have had a good amount).
Again, max, you cannot legally use a cover version without
permission of the publisher in your documentary. All the
cover versions you hear in movies and documentaries were
licensed - not from the band doing the cover, but from the
publisher of the music and lyrics.

Sprurlock didn't use the Queen song until his movie sold at
Sundance. The three and a half hour rough cut shown at the
festival didn't use any songs at all. Once Showtime picked up
the distribution rights they paid for the song rights.

But yes, before "Super Size Me" he had a lot of money. He
paid for the $65,000 rough cut of the movie with the money
he made from his MTY series.

Graeme
04-02-2010, 09:28 PM
I'm with directorik on this one, IP rights is not something you want to muck around with. Get the license from the original copyright owners or don't do it, end of story.

Disclaimer - I'm not a lawyer nor is the above to be considered legal advice. Thats what lawyers are for, talk to one.

ROC
04-02-2010, 09:32 PM
So what is maxham going to do?

Graeme
04-02-2010, 11:05 PM
I'd suggest he look for other music which he can obtain a license to use at a reasonable rate that fits his budget.

maxham
04-03-2010, 04:59 PM
You're all right ima have to do it the old fashioned way and either write my own score (heh i have no idea how to do so) or get someone to sponsor my movie so i can pay for liscensing (which that has been a blunder of an idea) So looks like I'm gonna just see what's out there on the free public use songs and hope for the best.

protilius
04-04-2010, 04:57 PM
I'll do it if you pay me and I can use an alias in its production.

Check out my collaborations album @ protilius.com to see what other covers I've done.

Cheers:)
N

Mango Reel
04-16-2010, 01:22 PM
@maxham - I'd reiterate the cautionary advice in these posts. Copyright law is relatively straightforward - it only tends to get complicated by people offering information on forums etc that they might not fully understand themselves.

Just using a song that infringes copyright in a production can leave the filmmaker liable to prosecution - even if you don't actually record the cover song yourself! Ignorance of the law is not a defence.

The easiest way to explain it is... imagine you buy a car from someone in a bar. You later get stopped by the Police and told the car was stolen. The Police impound the car and you lose everything - the money you paid for it and the car! If there's any suspicion you may have known the car was dodgey you'll also get prosecuted 'for handling stolen goods'. Whether you actually stole the car in the first place is irrelevent.

IP / Copyright is the same. If someone says its OK to steal a car... it doesn't mean you can legally do it!

There are always other options. You don't want to be the one THEY come after!

maxham
04-16-2010, 04:43 PM
i've decided that the footage I was going to use for that song is unusable and I can't afford the rights to the song so i have nixed the people are strange song idea. I have created a more clever intro to my documentary and I have it posted elsewhere.