So last year I was at a crux. I needed a new camera and a friend was selling his DVX100B for $1,000 but I also wanted to get into HD/HDV. When the prices dropped on the Canon HV20 to under $600 at B&H PHoto it became a no brainer and I went with the Canon HV20 HDV.

I've been using it for nearly a year and it's an absolutely amazing little camera. It does 24P at 1920x1080 with the cinegamma color for the alleged "film" look (It doesn't look like film to me, but it is a more aesthetically pleasing image).

I have since bought a JAG35 35mm film lens adapter for it for Depth of Field effects and also a Beachtek XLR mic input for it, plus a poor man's steady-cam rig. I have a cool little indie package for that shoots HDV. My primary use for the camera is shooting behind the scenes of other shoots, but it has also been a great little "B" camera for alternate shots and angles in high speed or heavy action scenes.

For post production I use the CINEFORM ASPECT HD/PROSPECT HD software/codec. It allows me to extract the true 24P from the 60i tape, plus it removes the heavy compression of MPEG2/M2T files standard in HDV editing. Also, it has settings and plugs directly into Adobe Premiere Pro CS3-CS4.

For beginners looking to get into filmmaking and making movies, this is an incredible starter camera. It has 24P, the look everyone is going for, plus it's 1920x1080, and even has an HDMI port for connecting to newer capture cards and monitoring on HDTV's.

For people looking to get into HDV on the cheap and want to learn the basics, this is the perfect starter camera in my opinion.

For several examples, go to www.vimeo.com and search out the keywords HV20 or HV30 and prepare to get blown away by the results and see them in HD online.

- Peter John Ross
sonnyboo.com

This is some good info, I'm still debating on getting this one, been researching this camera for over 6 months now. My main concern and reason for hesitation is the complaints people have about the awkwardness of the controls, specifically the manual focus and the little joystick thingy. According to some reviews, I guess one of the buttons is really close to the Record button or something. Do you have any comments on the ergonmics of this camera?

I, too, think that's an excellent camera.

It's too small for my tastes, but you get used to the size and the
bottom line is it has an excellent image. If you can jump through
the hoops sonnyboo does to improve the highly compressed HDV
format the final video files are amazing and quite good for color
correction and compositing.

Hmm, good to know. All the reviews on B&H say the picture quality is amazing. It sounds like an awesome novice HD camera. I guess my hang up is I have a sony which I like to control via a LANC, the HV20 doesn't appear to have a remote control feature, so believe it or not, that's really the key point that's keeping me from purchasing it so far. Either I'm lazy and like the controls on my tri-pod, or I just don't know anyother effective way, I drink to much coffee so steady shooting and smooth zooming by freehand is out of the question!

This is some good info, I'm still debating on getting this one, been researching this camera for over 6 months now. My main concern and reason for hesitation is the complaints people have about the awkwardness of the controls, specifically the manual focus and the little joystick thingy. According to some reviews, I guess one of the buttons is really close to the Record button or something. Do you have any comments on the ergonmics of this camera?

There is no denying it's a handicam, sub-$1,000 camcorder. That's why I do not recommend it for more professional work (and don't use it as such on my major shoots - as I use the Sony Z1U, Panasonic HVX200A, or the JVC HD110 for my more professional uses, but I have each of those cameras too).

What I mean by my recommendation, to make this abundantly clear, The Canon HV20/HV30 is the perfect camera.... UNDER $1,000 and it makes the best STARTER camera for beginners and newbies.

To compensate for depth of field and focus, I use the JAG35 adapter, so those controls on the camera don't mean anything to me.

For exposure settings, there is a handy work around with the mini SD card and the way to manually control the gain/exposure. See http://hv20.info/yopu/hv20aperturecontrol.mov

CLICK HERE for links to HV20/HV30 footage that will blow your mind (http://www.hv20.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8)

Well, that probably fits me then, as a videographer, I'd consider myself a novice, so maybe I should start with this camera. I've been eyeing the Sony Z1U though as well. choices choices.

Well, that probably fits me then, as a videographer, I'd consider myself a novice, so maybe I should start with this camera. I've been eyeing the Sony Z1U though as well. choices choices.

If you have $2,000-$3,000 then get the Z1U, but if you are looking for an under $700 camera or just want to get your feet wet - the Canon HV20 rocks.

Awesome thread. I have a HV30 and I love it so far. The picture quality is awesome. Thanks for that codec info too. Do you know if it will work in adobe premiere pro 2 or only in CS3 and CS4? I really just need to build a new computer and put a Mac OS on it and get Final Cut. This camera is also great in low light, I captured my friends concert in a dark bar and the footage still turned out great.

. This camera is also great in low light, I captured my friends concert in a dark bar and the footage still turned out great.

That's good to know, I have a lot of interior club scenes I need to film for an upcoming project next month. This camera is looking more appealing to me after reading this Thread.

I'm looking at buying one of these because I heard good things about it. http://www.irvdesign.com/product/mfr/
Too bad they are out of stock right now. Has anyone bought or used one and does it work well?

I'm looking at buying one of these because I heard good things about it. http://www.irvdesign.com/product/mfr/
Too bad they are out of stock right now. Has anyone bought or used one and does it work well?
Looks interesting.. of course the biggest issue with the manual focus, aside from the scroll wheel being tiny, is that it's not a mechanical focus adjustment, but rather an electronic one. As such, it will never give you quite the same result a mechanical focus adjustment would. That's the primary reason I wouldn't personally bother with this or any other similar solution for making the built in manual focus easier to use.

There is no denying it's a handicam, sub-$1,000 camcorder. That's why I do not recommend it for more professional work (and don't use it as such on my major shoots - as I use the Sony Z1U, Panasonic HVX200A, or the JVC HD110 for my more professional uses, but I have each of those cameras too).

What I mean by my recommendation, to make this abundantly clear, The Canon HV20/HV30 is the perfect camera.... UNDER $1,000 and it makes the best STARTER camera for beginners and newbies.

To compensate for depth of field and focus, I use the JAG35 adapter, so those controls on the camera don't mean anything to me.

For exposure settings, there is a handy work around with the mini SD card and the way to manually control the gain/exposure. See http://hv20.info/yopu/hv20aperturecontrol.mov

CLICK HERE for links to HV20/HV30 footage that will blow your mind (http://www.hv20.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8)

Man ,:bang: I have been researching cameras until my head spins , and I am finally narrowing it down to one of these three . The Canon HF 30 , HV 30 , or Sony HDR - XR520V . As I've always onwed Canon in the past , I'm really in favor of these two . How often do you use a viewfinder ? Is it only important when doing outdoor work , since the sun may be to bright to accurately trust the LCD ?

I have an external 7" LCD monitor that I use with a hood for outdoor shooting with my HV20...

There isn't enough support just yet for me to commit to the AVCHD codecs. They aren't bad, just not as common and the benefits are barely nominal compared to HDV-MPEG2.

I have an external 7" LCD monitor that I use with a hood for outdoor shooting with my HV20...

There isn't enough support just yet for me to commit to the AVCHD codecs. They aren't bad, just not as common and the benefits are barely nominal compared to HDV-MPEG2.
That's another issue that keeps coming up in my search ... the different codecs , and their ease of use . There is a lot of talk about the strain AVCHD puts on a computer . I am running Premiere Elements 7 on an E Machines ET 1641-02w with an Intel Celeron E 1400 processor @ 2GHZ with a 300 GB hard drive . I use Vista Home Premium 32 bit . My graphics card is NVIDIA GeForce 7050/NVIDIA nForce 610i . Do you see a need to upgrade my computer in order to handle these new codec issues that I may have as a result of going from Standard def ( Canon Fs100 ) to Hi-Def in the new camera I choose ? Thank you for your help .

Eh, I'd spend the $150 on the CINEFORM NEO SCENE software and not worry about any of it. I use CINEFORM's ASPECT HD product (now PROSPECT HD) and I have no issues at all. CHeck out www.cineform.com

- Ross

Thanks . I will be keeping all this information handy for reference . :clap: I will also have more questions . I appreciate your quick and friendly responses .


Larry

Eh, I'd spend the $150 on the CINEFORM NEO SCENE software and not worry about any of it. I use CINEFORM's ASPECT HD product (now PROSPECT HD) and I have no issues at all. CHeck out www.cineform.com

- Ross

Is Cineform any better then Vegas Pro 8? I have Windows so I just wanna make sure I can edit it to look more Cinema type.

Also, are there other Canon HD Cams that have the same specs(Mic port, 24p) HV20/HV30 that are INternal Hard Drive to save some tapes. :D

Is Cineform any better then Vegas Pro 8? I have Windows so I just wanna make sure I can edit it to look more Cinema type.

Also, are there other Canon HD Cams that have the same specs(Mic port, 24p) HV20/HV30 that are INternal Hard Drive to save some tapes. :D

Cineform is a PLUG for the NLE (Non-Linear Editor), so I believe NEO SCENE even plugs into VEGAS. I don't like the HARD DRIVE cameras because they use a semi-non standard CODEC that is not as efficient as M2T from tape...

Cineform is a PLUG for the NLE (Non-Linear Editor), so I believe NEO SCENE even plugs into VEGAS. I don't like the HARD DRIVE cameras because they use a semi-non standard CODEC that is not as efficient as M2T from tape...

So would that mean I get better results using tapes?

So would that mean I get better results using tapes?

Mileage will vary from user to user, but with Cineform, I definitely get better results from tape.

Any difference between the HV20 and the HV30?
Just wondering as the model numbers are different.

Any difference between the HV20 and the HV30?
Just wondering as the model numbers are different.

The HV30 has a black case and can do 30P, as well as 24P and 60i. The new HV40 can do 24P, 30P, and the 24 CF mode.

Other than that, they are all identical and they all do 24P at 1080 and 60i at 1080i.

This a good thread. For my personal challenge of begining filming I don't think a camera with a tape would be handy...One reason I am using it in a car and possibly a bicycle (shakey grounds) and another reason is that the local photo shop only sells the Hf20. I don't know if I want to purchase a camera online from a retailer I am unfamiliar with.
Meanwhile, downloading the filming from either of these cameras - can windows xp handle this? I fear that I will need to invest in a mac (because thats all I hear about when downloading film onto computors).
Thanks.

I have had no issues downloading video with XP, I've even downloaded and edited HD with Sony Vegas Pro. Would the render be faster if I had a 64 bit OS? Sure, but overall, no issues.

This a good thread. For my personal challenge of begining filming I don't think a camera with a tape would be handy...One reason I am using it in a car and possibly a bicycle (shakey grounds) and another reason is that the local photo shop only sells the Hf20. I don't know if I want to purchase a camera online from a retailer I am unfamiliar with.
Meanwhile, downloading the filming from either of these cameras - can windows xp handle this? I fear that I will need to invest in a mac (because thats all I hear about when downloading film onto computors).
Thanks.

XP can "handle" things, but it's a question of editing software really. Downloading from a camcorder with it's own CODEC (that's Compressor/Decompressor) that your editing software doesn't recognize will NOT make anything easier. Check the stats and find out which codec is being used with the HF20 (I believe it's AVCHD) and make sure that whatever software you use to edit supports that codec....

PC and MAC are 100% equal at this stage. One is never "better" than the other. People can tell you their own PREFERENCE but that doesn't make it better for YOU.

ok, I'm gonna make the effort and buy a HV20. I heard that the HV30 has bad reports on a loose door and it rattles too.

Thanks. My biggest fear is purchasing something that will require me to purchase a new computor. I realize that purchasing a camera is just the begining of many purchases.

Meanwhile I will probably purchase the Hf20 for reasons I stated. In addition to the local shop selling it at retail for $899 I see that Best Buy has a sale on it this week for $764. I don't want to buy something online because if something is wrong (from opening the box) its a bitch to get c.s. to do anything about it once you buy it. I have had a bad experience with a faulty piece of exersize equiptment I bought from a well known shopping dealer on tv and online. So that is why I prefer the local places where I can just go into the store if there is a problem after I buy it.
The only issues with these cameras is they don't sell them with the battery charger.

There is a battery charger for 7.99 US here: http://www.everydaysource.com/bcannb2lcs01.html. I haven't tried it, but I have purchased a product from this site before and was very satisfied with it. I love my HV20 and if the charger is an issue, I would grab one of these. I know I'm going to.

Eh, I'd spend the $150 on the CINEFORM NEO SCENE software and not worry about any of it. I use CINEFORM's ASPECT HD product (now PROSPECT HD) and I have no issues at all. CHeck out www.cineform.com

- Ross



I have had to read this thread a few times again to get the jist of it all...I had this fear it would be my computor that would be the problem but its finding software that would work with something like the hf20.
Even the hv30 has complaints of finding editing software...but looking at cineform neo scene lists that it can edit avchd...which is what the hf20 is. Or am I confusing myself?
I have searched online and find that a lot of folks out there have invested nearly a grand in a camera that does not come with editing software and are at a loss of what to do. I don't want to invest in a camera that leaves me hanging without choices...you would think in this day and age the software would / could keep up with the technology.

From the info on neoscene it states it works with mac and windows (which is what I have). So do I understand correctly that at least this software can edit avchd with windows?

Thanks again.

Yes, you can. I have edited avchd from a HV20 on an XP, being a Sony camera and format, Vegas easily reads avchd where some other editing programs may not.

Yes, you can. I have edited avchd from a HV20 on an XP, being a Sony camera and format, Vegas easily reads avchd where some other editing programs may not.

The HV20 is a CANON camera.... it's HDV tape only (which is NOT AVCHD) and so I'm more than a little confused by your statement.

I have had to read this thread a few times again to get the jist of it all...I had this fear it would be my computor that would be the problem but its finding software that would work with something like the hf20.
Even the hv30 has complaints of finding editing software...but looking at cineform neo scene lists that it can edit avchd...which is what the hf20 is. Or am I confusing myself?
I have searched online and find that a lot of folks out there have invested nearly a grand in a camera that does not come with editing software and are at a loss of what to do. I don't want to invest in a camera that leaves me hanging without choices...you would think in this day and age the software would / could keep up with the technology.

From the info on neoscene it states it works with mac and windows (which is what I have). So do I understand correctly that at least this software can edit avchd with windows?

Thanks again.
Hi everyone . I am using Adobe Premiere Elements 7 and it list the choice of importing AVCHD files . I didn't know this when I bought it and wasn't even aware that I may need it someday , but as I've got a Canon Fs 100 which is standard def , flash based , I haven't edited anything in HD with this program yet . The documentation mentions that you can use a variety of plug ins from Adobe and third party companies . Is Cineform a third party plug in or a separate program ? :D

Is Cineform a third party plug in or a separate program ? :D[/SIZE]

Cineform offers several PLUG INS, and they are not separate programs. I don't think the work with Premiere ELEMENTS, only PRO.

Cineform offers several PLUG INS, and they are not separate programs. I don't think the work with Premiere ELEMENTS, only PRO.
I see . I do really like the Hv 30 , but I 'm trying to stay with flash based Canon cameras . I just don't like the transfer times of tape , which when I started out was fine , but since going to flash memory ... man , it's just so fast . But , what you said about the lack of support for AVCHD , has got me wondering if I should just hold off on upgrading everything . Like I said before ,:bang:

I see . I do really like the Hv 30 , but I 'm trying to stay with flash based Canon cameras . I just don't like the transfer times of tape , which when I started out was fine , but since going to flash memory ... man , it's just so fast . But , what you said about the lack of support for AVCHD , has got me wondering if I should just hold off on upgrading everything . Like I said before ,:bang:
If you "hold off" on upgrading something you will always be holding off for what is next, unless you know a specific release date. Just thought I would add that, not sure if it relates or helps :D

If you "hold off" on upgrading something you will always be holding off for what is next, unless you know a specific release date. Just thought I would add that, not sure if it relates or helps :D
It helps . I said the same thing to myself , at least , a few times during my research . I just can't go back to tape . Besides the slow transfer speed , those stacks make a lot of noise when they fall over .... especially in the morning or middle of the night . I'm putting my money into the Canon Hf 100 . This thread did help me decide what I wanted in a camera , though . The manual controls and shooting modes on the HV 20/30 are the reason so many people love it . :lol:

I just bought my HV20 from Amazon for less then $500, Brand New-just open box.
Warranty card is also included. Man I can't wait!

I just bought my HV20 from Amazon for less then $500, Brand New-just open box.
Warranty card is also included. Man I can't wait!

So how do you like the camera?

Sonnyboo, can you post a picture of your whole HV20 rig, with the Beachtek, mic, lens adapter and poor man's steadicam? I've seen plenty of pictures of just the camera, but I want to see one all tricked out to give me something to drool over until I have enough saved.

Anyone use the HV40? It appears to be identical to an HV30 with the addition of a manual WB and native 24p in addition to the 60i/24p mode on the 30 series.

Anyone use the HV40? It appears to be identical to an HV30 with the addition of a manual WB and native 24p in addition to the 60i/24p mode on the 30 series.

It does HDV 24P/60i (with 3:2 pulldown) and the 24F mode which is the same as the Canon XHA1.

It does HDV 24P/60i (with 3:2 pulldown) and the 24F mode which is the same as the Canon XHA1.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding this, but Canon documentation implies that it does the above rate as well as a non-pulldown 24p rate as well..


60i, Native 24p Progressive (records at 24p), 24p Progressive (records at 60i), 30p Progressive (records at 60i)

Or are we talking about the same thing? :huh: Sorry, that's vague - just wondering if we're describing the same two modes and I'm just too new to get it.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding this, but Canon documentation implies that it does the above rate as well as a non-pulldown 24p rate as well..



Or are we talking about the same thing? :huh: Sorry, that's vague - just wondering if we're describing the same two modes and I'm just too new to get it.

24p/60i is the one with pulldown. 24f is canon's 'true' 24 progressive frame mode.

Thanks, sometimes asking manufacturers to use consistent terminology is futile.

So....

Anyone use an HV40?