How much would you like to be paid?

123kingjet said:

Just asking, but how much money a year do you guys like to be paid?

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I think most would respond, "enough to make a living." But most director/writer/producer jobs are freelance, so we get fees instead of annual salaries. And the amount varies from gig to gig. In LA, you're looking at $75K as a minimum starting salary. On a modestly budgeted film, that would pay one director for one feature film.

How much money would you be willing to take in order to provide your movie to a distributer?

Please be reasonable when responding. Keep it in a sensible range like 3000 a month, for a company does that sound reasonable? Or would you guys rather be paid on commission bases where the more movies you sell, the more you make.

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You generally get an upfront fee and then a percentage of the backend for most distribution deals. Both terms are negotiable and vary widely in range.

Also another question for you filmmakers, how long does it take to make a movie and on average, how many movies have you made?

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That really depends on the movie, both in terms of logistics and budget. My feature film took about two weeks to shoot and a few months to post. My friend just made a $2 million film that had 19 days to shoot and a few months to post. Another friend took about a year to post a similarly budgeted film.

How much ya got?? ....sorry, that wasn't exactly constructive, was it?

I am glad this is a post, because I don't have any idea....so long as I am treated fairly....


-- spinner

There isn't a fixed answer to these questions because each movie is a unique project.

I'm also not sure I understand some of your questions. For instance, when you ask how long it take to make a film, do you mean the actual production/post production? Or, do you mean from concept to post production?

The production element of a film can go from three weeks to up to six months... post production can go about the same. However, it often takes a year for a screenplay to go from idea to a script that's ready for production. Pre-production can take anything up to three years. So, in fact you can be looking at a four to five year process to make a movie.

In terms of money... that also floats. You have to think of each movie as a small business... investment goes in, as does labour... each movie attempts to bring more in from sales than it spent on production.

The figure people will sell a film for often depends on what part of the distribution cycle of desperation they are in... if they've just finished post and are all optimistic they'll want a higher figure than if they've had nine months of rejections from other distributors.

In terms of what I'd like to get paid... well, most indies would be happy to get paid, full stop. Personally as a screen writer I don't like to cut a deal that's worth less than $50K... unless I've bills that need paying and no work! In which case, make me an offer. I've know good writers take "writer for hire" gigs where they knocked out a screenplay for $5K.

123kingjet said:

Just asking, but how much money a year do you guys like to be paid? How much money would you be willing to take in order to provide your movie to a distributer?

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I would like to be paid way more than I get paid. I'm willing to take the best offer.

Please be reasonable when responding. Keep it in a sensible range like 3000 a month, for a company does that sound reasonable? Or would you guys rather be paid on commission bases where the more movies you sell, the more you make.

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$3,000 a month isn't reasonable. Not to me. That isn't sensible range for me as an
individual so no way would $3,000 a month be a sensible range for my company.

I don't like to be paid on a commission basis, or take a percentage. Too many of the
small, DVT distributors want to pay very little up front and promise a high percentage
and that's too easy to hide. I would rather get a higher up front payment and a small
percentage. I'm quite realistic when it comes to the movies I make and the market.

Also another question for you filmmakers, how long does it take to make a movie and on average, how many movies have you made?

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I agree with Beeble and clive. This question is too broad to answer. I've shot movies in three
days with ten days of post production. I once cut and did all the audio work on a
feature (80min) in 40 hours - straight. I ran out of money on one movie with 4 days
left to shoot, took a year (to the day) to raised enough to get it in the can, took
another 14 months off to raise the post-production money and finished it just about
4 years after the cast auditions.

On average, I shoot for 18 to 24 days, cut the picture in 24 and do the all the audio
work in 18. So a total of 10 to 12 weeks.

Wow thanks you guys for all the input. I was asking to evaluate how many production companies I should allow in my distribution established online sort of like Netflix but Indie style.

Reading what you guys have told me, would 20,000 k a month sound reasonable?

And by the how long it takes to make a movie, I was referring to full length films that are of excellent quality. Films that would sell for $5 each.

opps I accidently put 20,000 k when I meant $20,000. Sorry.

I...would probably be happy with whatever would allow me to live (reasonably) comfortable and be able to write for a living.

123kingjet said:

Reading what you guys have told me, would 20,000 k a month sound reasonable?

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I'm not exactly understanding the monthly payment. What would that cover and for how long would the payments be? What would you want for that?

I, too, am confused on what the $20,000 a month is about.
Is that figure for running a company, including salaries,
insurance, taxes and overhead?

123kingjet said:

I was asking to evaluate how many production companies I should allow in my distribution established online sort of like Netflix but Indie style.

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I don't understand this, either.

Are you thinking of starting a company like NetFlix? And wanting
to know how many prodCo's you should allow to to have their
movies in your rental system?

directorik said:

I, too, am confused on what the $20,000 a month is about.
Is that figure for running a company, including salaries,
insurance, taxes and overhead?


I don't understand this, either.

Are you thinking of starting a company like NetFlix? And wanting
to know how many prodCo's you should allow to to have their
movies in your rental system?

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I tried responding to this question yesterday through a long explanation but I guess the website didn't receive it. So I guess I'll type it again...

Responding to your question Directorik and anyone else asking, yes thats exactly what I was looking for. Its like Netflix except that 20,000 each month has to be competed for. 10 producers get the spot.

I would like to explain the rest but since the project is in the works, as my programmer says it would require a lot of money, I am only gathering interest for now.

This is only suppose to be a distributing company online, and the hope is that you keep all the rights to your film. We just promote it to people online.

My project that is in reasonable goal to achieve right now is providing a "trailer studio" for production comapanies. Send us your trailers and spread the word to your film. Thats all for now

As I am a man of my words, I will keep you guys updated. Thats if you guys are interested in this project.

I'm all for new business models, but this strikes me as kind of an odd idea. NO ONE does it this way. Netflix either buys copies of the movie outright or does revenue sharing. And they obviously don't limit themselves to 10 movies.

If you compare yourself to a traditional distributor (like a Lionsgate for example), they do limit the number of films they take on, but again, they do an upfront fee plus revenue sharing. I can't think of any way to sustain a month payment model for producers.

How do you see your revenue model for your business? How would YOU make money?

123kingjet said:

I tried responding to this question yesterday through a long explanation but I guess the website didn't receive it. So I guess I'll type it again...

Responding to your question Directorik and anyone else asking, yes thats exactly what I was looking for. Its like Netflix except that 20,000 each month has to be competed for. 10 producers get the spot.

I would like to explain the rest but since the project is in the works, as my programmer says it would require a lot of money, I am only gathering interest for now.

This is only suppose to be a distributing company online, and the hope is that you keep all the rights to your film. We just promote it to people online.

My project that is in reasonable goal to achieve right now is providing a "trailer studio" for production comapanies. Send us your trailers and spread the word to your film. Thats all for now

As I am a man of my words, I will keep you guys updated. Thats if you guys are interested in this project.

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I could definitely get into something like that.

Definitely keep us posted, eh?

Beeblebrox said:

I'm all for new business models, but this strikes me as kind of an odd idea. NO ONE does it this way. Netflix either buys copies of the movie outright or does revenue sharing. And they obviously don't limit themselves to 10 movies.

If you compare yourself to a traditional distributor (like a Lionsgate for example), they do limit the number of films they take on, but again, they do an upfront fee plus revenue sharing. I can't think of any way to sustain a month payment model for producers.

How do you see your revenue model for your business? How would YOU make money?

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I limit myself to 10 production companies in order to make money for myself. See if I get 100,000 subscribers from the U.S, which is tiny compared to Netflix with 8mil, I would make 300,000 dollars. 200,000 would go to the winning producers and the remaining 100,000 would be left for my web site costs and my company.

I would pay a upfront fee for producers and also pay them for their online content movies that are also for free through ad revenue. 1000 page views equals 5 dollars. The benefit of subscribing is so that you can watch movies in Higher quality and have them delivered to your door steps without thinks about returning them.

If they do return them, they get a sort of cash back rewarded which can then be used to get stuff that would intern sort of promote the site.

20000 dollars a month is competed for. Meaning you might receive 20000 a month if your movies happen to always be the most watched.

We do not keep the rights to your films because there is no need to. Subsequently, we don't pay as much as a traditional distributer. Instead, the films that fail to make the cut, stay in the online database.

We strive to make our producers more like our partners then like a distant associate. That said, the plan is to make as much as our producers make. No more, no less. We are therefore equals.

Expect completion 1 year from now

OK... I've this kind of maths before and it never works. The problem is, as I see it, for the model to work it requires 100,000 subscribers.

You're right, this is a small percentage of Netflix customers... but, what percentage of those customers use Netflix to exclusively watch no-name drama from unknown directors? And surely the whole point of Netflix is the huge range of choices... not just a limited choice of ten movies.

I just don't see how this works from a customer's point of view.

Film marketing is an incredibly complex issue, because each film is a unique product and finding a connection between the audience and the film is incredibly difficult. It's not the kind of business you should get into if you've no experience of the film industry.

I can't tell you how many people I've seen look at indie film making and then at the internet, only to them leap to the conclusion that there is natural synergy between the two... there isn't.

The kind of movies that are attracted to this kind of distribution will be those that can't get a traditional release. The reason they can't get a legitimate release is because the distributors couldn't see a way to connect a paying audience to the product. Which means, unless you've discovered a new way to sell unknown movies to a customer base prepared to pay for them, then you'll be lucky to achieve 100 subscribers.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there aren't untapped audiences... there are, but I've yet to hear anyone pitch an online film distribution scheme that didn't sound like it was written on the back of a cereal box.

Bottom line is you're asking the wrong questions... and the fact that you're asking them tells me you don't know enough about the business to survive... especially in distribution.

Wow. I wrote a whole rant last night and then decided "screw it" and didn't post... but Clive nailed it.

I don't even understand your idea properly. Are you looking to distribute the works of 10 producers, or will you be hosting as many features on your site as possible and only compensate the 10-most-viewed? If that's the case, bull.

You said at one point you wanted to consider the producer and yourself (the distributor) as equal partners... so let's say I make a feature for $10-20K, hire the crew, inspire the cast, raise the funds, get the equipment, write the script, shoot the sucker over 6 weeks to a year, spend all of my time and energy as well as that of my cast and crew... edit it, export it in a format ready for the web....

And then you host it on your site and are entitled to 50% of the work?

Excuse my french, but FUCK THAT.

The reason traditional distribution is so heavy on their cut is because they market it to the mainstream with huge ad budgets and executive payrolls. Half of it is just executive memberships to gof clubs and other such inflated overhead. Which is why they won't take a movie who they don't think has the potential to make the millions needed to cover payroll/marketing/distribution costs on a large scale.

So if you're looking to serve the "indies" at the low-budget, can't get distribution level... then it's likely that 99% of the movies you host will be pretty crappy. So as Clive says, how are you going to find your market for 100,000 people if 99% of your movies are crap indies?
And for your HALF of the profit, what will YOU be doing that equals the time and effort of my 50+ crew/cast and all their work at MAKING a product that you can put in stock?

Distribution over the internet on the level you're talking about is the equivalent of a "fulfillment house". Since you're hosting more than one movie, obviously all you have to do is develop ONE system and apply it to all movies with very little difference of work between titles.

So you get 50% for that?
And since I don't even understand your actual goals, methods, etc... (you said it yourself, you're just in the early stages of an IDEA), I would NEVER go for this.

Revver does a 50/50 split of ad revenue for short/viral videos... most I've gotten on one video is a little over 2000 views, which netted me approxamtely $3 in ad revenue. Now... do you think it's EASIER or HARDER to get someone to sit through a feature film?

So to me, it sounds like someone hasn't done their research and is looking to grab a slice of the "distribution money train pie" while "helping" indies... but the indies here seem to have a better grasp on how to distribute then you do.... hmmm...

clive said:

Bottom line is you're asking the wrong questions... and the fact that you're asking them tells me you don't know enough about the business to survive... especially in distribution.

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How does one learn if they don't ask questions?

I remember being told this when I was just starting out. It froze me.
I came close to getting out of the business I was just exploring.
Fortunately soon after I met someone who answered my questions
which lead me to a career I love.

No offense to you, clive, I know you don't mean to put kingjet down,
but asking questions here is what this place is all about. Especially for
people who don't know enough about the business to survive. Your
experience can be of invaluable benefit to him and the rest of us.

That said, nothing in your business model (so far) makes any sense
to me, kingjet. You aren't talking 100,000 people, you are talking
100,000 people every month paying to watch movies made by
unknowns director starring no known actors. Have you done any
research to suggest that that many people are interested in the kinds
of films you will host? And are interested in paying $5 to watch them?

And like Spatula, I would throw away a contract where the on-line
distributor is an equal partner with me, the producer. Perhaps a re-think
of that aspect might be in order.

I understand what you're saying Rik, but unless people tell you you're asking the wrong questions, you never get to ask the right ones.

I watch people everyday let other people walk into train wrecks, simply because they won't be honest in their opinions. If someone writes a bad script and I tell them it's great, I may keep them in the business but at what cost? Same with a business plan...

My lack of understanding of the way the distribution worked, when I first started in the business, cost me: a house, two marriages, a personal bankruptcy, a dog and set my career back about seven years. All of which could have been avoided if someone had done for me, what I just did for kingjet.

Nicely said guys both Rik and Clive. I will surely look way more into it before I release this idea. I have a little experience in marketing but this is totally different that what I have done in the past. Thanks for the comments and remarks no matter how harsh they are , I understand its for the better and I love the bad comments that you guys are throwing at me. Because if not now, then it would be later so all the better.

As for the equal status thing I thought it was fair that the amount of marketing I throw towards selling your movies would be equivalent, but I guess that's farce so if that must be, I'll accept no profit for the first year or so.

Actually, after just doing some more research, I would like to ask you guys what you think about the website createspace.com. This website is managed by Amazon. I would like to hear comments about this site and if you would use it. If you would, tell me why and if you wouldn't, tell me what parts you would like to see more off.

As for now, what do you guys think about a website that would promote your trailers for free?

I am sorry if my questions and ideas sound like their from "the back of a cereal box", as this industry is a curiosity to me, I hope you would be kind it letting me help you.

123kingjet said:

As for now, what do you guys think about a website that would promote your trailers for free?

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Well, there are hundreds of those out there. You don't look at them, I don't
look at them, no one I knows looks at them. And there are a lot of sites like
createspace.com, too. DVD "on demand" sites abound - though this one, being
directly connected to Amazon has it's advantage. I used it when it was called
CustomFlix.

But we continue to come back to the real problem with independent films. How
do you get people to pay to watch a movie made filmmakers they don't know,
starring actors they've never heard of? You don't do it. clive doesn't do it. I don't
do it. Getting a movie on line is easy, getting paying customers isn't. Have you
thought of how you are going to bring in the number you will need to generate
the kind of money you need? Who is the market for indie film?

Now if you can come up with a way to get the word out there, to get people
to pay money to see indie films, you've got yourself a business. The hosting of
the films is the easy part. All the hosting/shared revenue sites I've ever seen
then expect the filmmaker to do all the advertising. It's the filmmaker who
needs to bring in the page hits. As a producer of independent films, if you could
get me 100,000 hits a month - hell!, even 10,000 hits a month - on my movie
page through creatspace.com I'd be willing to share revenue 50/50 with you.