ITOOFC 5 is coming! We need suggestions. If you are unfamiliar with ITOOFC please see #4's threads.

ITOOFC 4 (www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=8739)
ITOOFC 4 Results (www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?p=44867)

Starting date and rules TBD, how do you guys want to do this?

There will be prizes!

Jungle Software
www.junglesoftware.com
Makers of Gorilla
Film Production Software for the Independent Filmmaker

Final Draft Screenwriting Software

More will be added.

YES!!! I shall begin brainstorming immediately.. in a couple hours.

I like the idea of using one screenplay.. it would be fun to see different interpretations of the same script. :)

Hmm... it would be very interesting to see the same script. It would have to be a well-planned story, so that everyone can participate. Well-written too, so people will participate ;)

Too bad I'm in pre-prod for a first big project, or I'd join. How about we make the contest for 30 minute dramas about America falling to a war? I'm just speaking off the top of my head here.

If it is all based on the same script, then the script should be carefully written to keep everything simple -- so as not to put a heavy financial or shot-location burden on participants.

Why not have a script contest for writers, or a collaborative approved contest, and then follow up with the video one?

If it is all based on the same script, then the script should be carefully written to keep everything simple -- so as not to put a heavy financial or shot-location burden on participants.

One way around that is to maybe provide 10 or 20 required pieces of dialogue? And then each participant can write any movie/genre around those 10 or 20 pieces of dialogue that they'd like.

The phrase "Would you like to learn to fly? Would you like to see me try?"* can either be from a warm family film where grandpa Ed teaches his grandson how to man a single jet airplane... or can be the words a coked-out rock musician screams as he contemplates jumping from his 30th-floor hotel room balcany.

*if you get that reference you are my new best friend.

I'm all for the idea of a single theme - but using one screenplay just isn't that appealing. For me, putting my best effort into an original script is much more engaging than someone else's.

I remember editing down to 5 minutes on the last round - that was difficult. A range (5 to 10) would make it a little easier with the last minute continuity decisions.

In any case, I'm looking forward to Round 5!

My gut reaction is to go with a theme and let people write.

The only interesting varaition would be to have the writing done on a secret santa basis -- so every contest writes a 5-10 minute script -- but that script is then "fixed/adapted" and filmed by another entrant.

So, Spatula writes a script -- but I end up making it and SP ends up making mine -- etc.

I know it's too mad to word -- and the best thing would be to keep it simple -- but it was one of those ideas that just tickled me.

I mean would we all try and write rotten scripts, just to stick to one another -- or would we set up things impossible to shoot on under $40K.

Oh, the merry Chirstmas japes we could have with that scenario.

The only thing I think that we should do, is make it about Santa -- I just watched Bad Santa again and you can;t have too many Santa films.

I'm more for different interpretations of the same script or even just a scene. I might even be able to participate this time around...if not, I'll judge again.

FOA, if anyone doesn't know that reference...they weren't paying attention during the handing out of the "You must watch this film" portion of the orientation for life on this planet :) This time around, we should put Geldof in white robes and have him carry a staff up a mountain ;)

On the concept of using the same script, I hate the idea for several reasons:

1) I'm too busy making my own films to spend a week or two on someone else's brainchild for a contest.
2) Anyone who has enough time on their hands to spend on someone else's script (or on competitions like " 21 days" etc.) should be making their own film, not doing contests.
3) The script has the potential to be crummy. Eye of the Beholder thing.
4) At least 50% of a good film is in the script. As an indie filmmaker, I'd rather be judged on the totality of my talent.
5) For the same reason that those "21 day" and "1 day" contests are a waste of time, everyone doing the same script is a waste of time. I don't care how long someone took to make something. I just care if it was good or not. Why? Because no one in the "Industry" cares how much money, time, or sweat you put into something. No one in the civilian, non-filmmaking world cares either..!

It ends up being insider navel gazing.

All in all, that kind of stuff is nifty collaborationist collectivistism (not to sound too harsh), but if I were in charge, I'd just make it a straight out competition with a couple of categories like "Best Short", "Best Trailer", "Best Animation", that kind of thing. I think we're all here to get noticed and get our films made, not win competitions that are geared towards something OTHER than making the best film possible, whatever its script or form.

The same script/scene idea is what they did for project greenlight.. there was always VASTLY different interpretations of those, and it's interesting to watch.

I honestly think that would be the most fun, and worthwhile edition of this competition to date.

Project Greenlight's award was to be able to make a feature film and to be on a reality show. It makes it worth the time to do it. Is Indie Talk going to offer that? If not, I think it ought to be a showcase of the work that people are doing already.

and for those of us whose weak point is scripting?

Collaborate with someone who writes well.

Lookit, you've got all these people on this site who've already got films made and haven't been accepted in festivals - I've been reading Alphie's posts, for instance. String of bad luck, the fates, headaches, whatever, may be responsible. Having a competition that allows you to submit pretty much anything like a tradtional film competition is, to my mind, far more helpful to the users of the site than something in which only a couple of people (who have copious amounts of time) can afford to do. I can't afford to piddle away time doing a competition on something that isn't going to get me much. I daresay not too many other people can either, not if their talents are in demand elsewhere.

Ladd, if you are not interested, fine, but it's kind of pointless to post you are not interested when this thread is for ideas. The benefits haven't even been decided yet. I will work on getting good exposure. Example: The winning film could stream on the homepage for two weeks. I am going to come up with some more ideas. That's what this thread is for. :)

There will be prizes!

One sponsor:

Jungle Software
www.junglesoftware.com
Makers of Gorilla
Film Production Software for the Independent Filmmaker

More sponsors to be added, details soon.

This time it's going to be well organized, and will occur annually or semi-annually, with prizes, sponsors, and exposure. What we need is your help, we want to give you what you want!

Freakin' awesome idea (http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=9513). Okay, I had to throw that in but I take no responsibility for it though. :lol:

Two things:


I would love nothing more to participate, but my chemotherapy keeps me too weak. Hell, I haven't finished my current project for three months now because of it and BC5 is only supposed to have a runtime of around four minutes or so... :grumpy: I'm still working on it, I swear!
Can anyone submit a script (Including myself who many not be able to participate)? I think I have a perfect little script I would like to see made.

I personally like the idea of everyone shooting the same script. Would love to see that evolution and how every element is interpreted.

Having said that...

If you go that route, I think the filmmakers should be able to, at the very least, create their own title for the film along with some kind of an agreement that says each filmmaker has the right to submit it to festivals, online, etc.

The screenwriter(s) could still get the credit but this way, the film(s) have a little more longevity for the filmmakers...

Just thinking out loud.

filmy

If you go that route, I think the filmmakers should be able to, at the very least, create their own title for the film along with some kind of an agreement that says each filmmaker has the right to submit it to festivals, online, etc.

The screenwriter(s) could still get the credit but this way, the film(s) have a little more longevity for the filmmakers...

I second Filmy's ideas.

I would also like to see the same script used. That way we can assure the film was made for this comp, instead of some silly way like having an actor use a prop or line of dialogue. If we try this idea, what length? 5.. 10 min.? Would anyone be opposed to filmy selecting the script? He is our Screenwriting Guru, so to me it makes sense. If we can decide on this, we can get the ball rolling faster.

I think a 5 minute short would be good...not overly time consuming for folks to participate, but 10 minutes would be more festival friendly when all is done. You can fit more story in 10 mins too :)

We can have the screenplay to be submitted be between 5 and 10 pages, giving the writer a little freedom.

Actually.. 5 minutes would probably be more festival friendly. It's easier for a festival coordinator to find 5 minutes in the schedule than 10. ;)

I also agree that 5 is a good length. A concise script can accomplish a lot in 5 minutes. It's less pages to deal with shooting-wise, and it might also be more of a challenge, because you've got to come out of the box with your A game, there's no 'warm up' time in something that length. (Not that there's much more in a 10 minute film..)

I'm all for Filmy picking the script. The question remains though, how specific or vague will it be? I think if it were a strong story, but a bit vague from the character and location standpoint it would leave more to be determined by the film maker and their team, which would probably be a little more interesting to watch. Either way though, using the same script feels like the best option, and it's certainly going to provide a more even playing field, from the standpoint that we'd all be working with the same material. In that way, all the films are judged on how well they told that story, and whether or not the judges liked the story told is irrelevant.

As a previous judge, I must say that some of the entries were hard to watch, simply because the story was unclear, or poorly formed. Taking that element out of the equation allows for a better illustration of directoral choices, and overall cinematic merit. Also, assuming it's a good script, the likelihood of the films doing well at festivals is much higher as well.

I would imagine the top 3 or top 5 (depending on how many are submitted of course) would stand to do well on the festival circuit, with the overall winner here being in a good position to have a great festival run.

That's my $.02. I'm looking forward to this, it should be fun!

I like the idea of having the one script with different variations- but I think there needs to be something to differ the films... how about the conclusions are left to the filmmakers?

Aka- if it's a 5 page script, the filmmaker writes pages 6 themselves. That way we'll get different endings for the same story?

Filmmakers should choose:
-Title
-Character Names
-Resolution

That's what I'd like.

I'm not sure conclusions should be left to the filmmakers, the films will all be very different using the same script and it'd be interesting to see each difference using the same exact script.

Ladd, if you are not interested, fine, but it's kind of pointless to post you are not interested when this thread is for ideas. The benefits haven't even been decided yet. I will work on getting good exposure. Example: The winning film could stream on the homepage for two weeks. I am going to come up with some more ideas. That's what this thread is for. :)

Hey Indie, I'm not saying I'm not interested. I'm saying I think it would be much better for all users to have a more traditional competition that doesn't require people to stop whatever they're doing in the real world to perform a circus trick for a couple of weeks.

I've read countless posts on this site about people who haven't gotten distribution for films, haven't gotten accepted into festivals, and so forth. There's a lot of good work that could be submitted already if categories were more traditional - as in, "Feature" and "Animation" and "Short" and "Music Video."

Frankly, I think you'd have a lot more submissions - with much higher quality - if you didn't restrict it in this manner. That's my two cents, along with my paid premium membership dues.

I like the same script or similar script idea. The idea is -- this is our competition, not their festival. We're flooded with festivals, and in turn the festivals are flooded with us! Back in the day, college course Production I the script was based on do-ability (no budget and simple), so we had a kind of internal compeition in the class for whose script would be the easiet to produce and then broke into small groups to produce it. Mine happend to have won. I wonder if I can find it around and upload it for you people. Or here's another idea, rewrite and produce a particular scene from a Shakesperian play.

Hey Indie, I'm not saying I'm not interested. I'm saying I think it would be much better for all users to have a more traditional competition that doesn't require people to stop whatever they're doing in the real world to perform a circus trick for a couple of weeks.

I've read countless posts on this site about people who haven't gotten distribution for films, haven't gotten accepted into festivals, and so forth. There's a lot of good work that could be submitted already if categories were more traditional - as in, "Feature" and "Animation" and "Short" and "Music Video."

Frankly, I think you'd have a lot more submissions - with much higher quality - if you didn't restrict it in this manner. That's my two cents, along with my paid premium membership dues.
This is not a film festival, it's a filmmaking competition, and it's the fifth one. Everyone who has entered in the past has enjoyed it. As far as an actual festival (online, or actual), that has been suggested as well, but is separate from this, and could happen also. Quality products have actually been a result of this competition, and have gone on to win festivals http://www.indietalk.com/showpost.php?p=53280&postcount=63.

I like the same script or similar script idea. The idea is -- this is our competition, not their festival.
Exactly.

I like the idea, but of course it all depends on the script. Once the script is picked, you'll see who wants to be involved.

Personally, when I read it, I'll be looking for one thing and one thing only: does it affect me? Regardless of a competition, one does not want to waste one's time on a project that will not showcase one's abilities.

That said, it is always quite intriguing to work outside of my comfort zone.

Bring it on.

OH, by the way, as this is the direction it seems to be going, can we start a poll of what TYPE of film everyone wants to make? That will help narrow down the script submissions.

Jim

I like the idea, but of course it all depends on the script. Once the script is picked, you'll see who wants to be involved.

Personally, when I read it, I'll be looking for one thing and one thing only: does it affect me? Regardless of a competition, one does not want to waste one's time on a project that will not showcase one's abilities.

That said, it is always quite intriguing to work outside of my comfort zone.

Bring it on.

OH, by the way, as this is the direction it seems to be going, can we start a poll of what TYPE of film everyone wants to make? That will help narrow down the script submissions.

Jim
Sure. I'll add it to this thread.

...I think it would be much better for all users to have a more traditional competition...We're just trying something new this year, that's all. Previous ITOOFC competitions were traditional in the way you describe.

If the same competition followed the same rules year after year, it would start to get stagnant and interest may wane. Try something new. :)

OH, by the way, as this is the direction it seems to be going, can we start a poll of what TYPE of film everyone wants to make? That will help narrow down the script submissions.Agreed. Should a voting thread be started? I'll vote comedy. Anyone can do comedy on a zero budget (RE: Annoying Brian, I'm still laughing at this one).

First of all I am really excited that a new ITOOFC is now in the works. I like the idea of all competitors doing the same script. It will be very interesting to see how each person will be able to interpert an idea.

My suggestion at this point would only be that each filmmaker that wanted to participate be given the chance to see the script for overall logistics to be considered before commiting to particpating.

I really hope to be able to participate. I enjoyed last years competition, everyone treated me fairly with the critiques I received from the judges.

Signed,
Eddie

Words of wisdom: It takes more than a knife to win a competition -

and for those of us whose weak point is scripting?

Scripting is always the weakest area for indies -- which is the reason that competitions ought to encourage people to write their own scripts -- it's only by seeing what happens when what you write is translated into something you have to cut, that you get to see your strengths and weaknesses.

So, from that POV I'm with Ladd on this one -- but for different reasons.

But in the larger scheme of things what I really understand is this -- 98% of the spec scripts currently being circulated around the industry are unreadable (got this from a very reliable anonymous source).

In indie film making where there isn't the insistent financial need to reject bad scripts, the figures are even worse.

The reason I mention this is this -- I really believe any contest we run has to encourage people to become better writers. It has to challenge their ability to write.

So, what I'd like to see set is this:

You must write and shoot a film that runs exactly five minutes -- the film must have no more than twenty-five lines of dialogue, it must be high concept and must be split into four distinct acts. -- At the end of the film the protagonist must not only have changed, but have learned something.

All entries must conclude with a title page, which contains their twenty-five word, high concept logline.

Now, that's a real challenge!

There is plenty of info on four act structure already on this site -- Filmy's just given me a great definition of high concept I'm sure he'd let me post, and who couldn't do with some logline practice.

Over to you guys.

My vote would be original scripts, not one script. If you have one script I feel that you're in a actor/director/cameraman contest. It's not what was said, but how you filmed what was said, or how you said it.

I'd go for something similar to the project that was going around awhile back...everyone shoots their own interpretation of a similar concept (to steal one of the ideas) A film centered on a fountain pen that goes from one to the other to the other. Maybe I'll do a comedy with the pen. A guy finds in on the ground, picks it up and every time he looks at it the pen squirts him, or leaks in his pocket...but everytime he curses that, he looks down and narrowly misses being run over by a bus, or having a piano fall on him. What he thinks is bad luck is actually great luck. Someone else may do something about the pen giving them memories of their grandfather, or someone might do a script about the pen reminding them of a terrible time. All different, but all could be put together as a set.

I really liked that idea...make 'em laugh, make 'em cry all at the same time.

Obviously the pen idea is "stolen", so we couldn't use that. But there are tons of other linking ideas that could work. A chain letter. An event. A computer game. etc.

There's my 2 cents.

Chris

My name is Fabio, I live in California and I am a composer.
I would lile to offer my services for free to anyone whom is interested in having an original soundtrack for this competition . My specialty is classical music but I can wirte any genre. You can check out my website:
www.musimax.com

Fabio SIRONI

Cell: 707-971-0100

How about using the same public domain short story as a seed for an adaptation. Archive.org has thousands of short and novel lenth texts that are all PD. Maybe someone can decide on an interesting short story and have everyone adapt it to their own version?

C

I love the idea of one script, different directors. I'm in! I like that this isn't the usual competition with categories and filmmakers submitting their already finished movies. There are thousands of those out there.

I would LOVE the idea of not even know what script I'm getting. How exciting. Get a script in the mail and have (fill in the blank) many weeks to finish it. It would be a challenge to make a movie from a script I don't particularly like. I'm for making it even harder. Other than location what if we can't change a word in the script?

The phrase "Would you like to learn to fly? Would you like to see me try?"*

*if you get that reference you are my new best friend.

"Pink Floyd, The Wall" Song title I think is "Love Turns Grey" or "Grey Days"

I'm your new best friend!!! :):)

I agree about dialogue and phrases rather than a script, but I won't be filming this year- too busy.

I will happily judge again though, if ya' still want me.

This is a tough one. I'm inclined to agree with Clive. That would be one heck of a challenge he poses! (though I'm not sure 5minute shorts are capable of so many distinct acts?) I sort of like the idea of a single script too as long as it's a good script. I guess this depends on what we are trying to judge. Cinematography skills? Directing? Writing? All of the Above?

That said, I'm all for sci-fi. :) EVERY indie can do comedy - it's like THE staple of indie filmmaking. We need something more challenging I say... especially if we all do the same script. Watching the same jokes over and over and over again could get old really fast.

Writing a (exactly) 5 minute short with (exactly) 4 acts with (exactly) the same outcome will give us (exactly) cookie-cutter scripts.

No offense to anyone on their ideas, but my vision of ITOOFC 5 is that we can vote on a <5 minute script to be used, no matter the number of acts, genre or any other type of common theme. I believe this will foster more creativity in the submissions.

Just my $0.02; take with a grain of salt; your mileage may vary; yadda, yadda, yadda...

Final Draft Screenwriting Software is in!

More to come.

This is leaning toward the one script idea. Filmy will choose it. Now lets figure out the rest. The screenplay can be part of the competition as well, and can win a prize.

I've been in love with the one script idea. And I can see a script contest filling that bill just fine.

Agreed. Should a voting thread be started? I'll vote comedy. Anyone can do comedy on a zero budget (RE: Annoying Brian, I'm still laughing at this one).
There's a poll already.

Final Draft Screenwriting Software is in!
...
The screenplay can be part of the competition as well, and can win a prize.

What better prize for a screenwriter than a copy of Final Draft? :)

What better prize for a screenwriter than a copy of Final Draft? :)

A final draft.

lol at me.
------

Anyway, I like this idea- you get a chance to write a script and then film a movie, even if they aren't the same thing. But there's the excitement of the writing comp, so cool. I'd really stress that I'd like to see some flexibility for the director to affect the ending of the script somehow- something to add our own individual signatures. It'd be like seeing the same film, only with multiple endings.

I would LOVE the idea of not even know what script I'm getting.

Not to be a party pooper, but I would rather see the script before committing to the contest.

-Jim

Spatula: your interpretation of the script is your signature. That's the point.

Comedy is winning.

Comedy is winning.And what a perfect coincidence... tomorrow is election day. I hope comedy is elected. :P

...but I'm probably now hated by the Science Fiction party. I can see the smear commercials now...

I voted for a comedy as well. The people I work with have been dying to do a comedy. It looks like the one script idea has been chosen and I could go either way. One of my favorite aspects is the script writing, but I definitely think it would be cool to see the different versions.

Spatula: your interpretation of the script is your signature. That's the point.

I know, I know.. but I've not been very intent on shooting other people's scripts, because I write to suit the resources I have (ultra low budget). So if it's going to be simply a contest of tech specs, I'd loose- but having an edge on creative design (aka the script) would level the playing field. But I digress, and will start the mud slinging (where's Zensteve?) here and now: I'll beat everybody even if my film is just a shot of a toilet with dubbed lines over. Huzah! Here's to me!

So if we don't use one script, what do you suggest? What about same script, alternate endings? Or what about building a script around a chosen treatment? (hmmm, I like that) This would allow you to be the screenwriter, but the stories would be the same.

The concept of each filmmaker creating their own 'alternate ending' into an accepted script has crossed my mind. :hmm:

Does anyone remember the PERSON / PLACE/ THING association game? We could place multiple options in each category out for a vote. The three highest votes are what the ~10 page script will contain.

For examples (not to be used):


PERSON: child / druggie / soldier / housewife / retiree / etc...
PLACE: woods / city / car lot / bathroom / car trunk (the Tarantino shot?) / etc...
THING: zippo / desk fan / severed Barbie head / posessed desk clock from hell / rubber poop / etc...

:yes:

I'm starting to lean toward my treatment idea. Screenwriters submit a treatment, the best one for this project is chosen, filmmakers write their screenplays (or have a screenwriter on their team) based on the treatment, and produce it.

I'm starting to lean toward my treatment idea. Screenwriters submit a treatment, the best one for this project is chosen, filmmakers write their screenplays (or have a screenwriter on their team) based on the treatment, and produce it.

I think you just answered your own question! :)

That would be good as well, because teams that work on improv/dialogue have a bit more leeway. Also, it'd be a neat exercise to write a 5-10min treatment, as opposed to a fleshed out script. Even more interesting to see how the final versions would differ.

We'll have this part decided on tomorrow, let's see how this idea is received by all.

Also you can help come up with a name, instead of ITOOFC... like "The IndieTalk Challenge".

I LOVE THE TREATMENT SUGGESTION.

This allows the filmmaker to write in their own style, and I'm stoked to not be limited to a certain TYPE of film. (For example, I personally don't wish to make a comedy - that's not my thing, and I don't care to have a comedy on my reel.)

Cheers!

I don't really see what is so bad about using a single script.. it's an idea that was presented last year, if not even longer ago.. clearly there are a number of people interested in it. I think people are having difficulty getting their heads around the concept enough to realize that it's not like they are giving up any kind of control. It levels the playing field in a manner to better allow judging of film making talent (SEPARATE from screen writing talent).

Having judged two previous ITOOFC's, it was difficult to be "fair" because there were some that were good, some that were.. ok, and some that were just painful to watch. By focusing on the production element (directoral skill, shot composition, etc) and using a single screenplay makes it more likely that the submissions will at least be watchable. There won't be some with good stories, and some without.

Even saying that someone can have a screenwriter on their team is no good, because some may choose not to, thinking they're better than they are, some may work with a screenwriter who isn't that great, etc.

What happened to the idea of screenwriters submitting scripts, which would be judged, and then having the winning script be the one used for this? I know I've seen other people in support of this, in this thread and elsewhere in the past... I know I'm not alone here, but if I am, fine I'll just go off and not worry about it, however, I'm positive that I've seen posts from both the "Filmmaking Guru" and "Screenwriting Guru" in support of the single script.. among others.

I don't presume to have any authority here. Seniority doesn't matter, because there are many people who have been here longer than I, and many who have been here for a shorter time. Obviously everyone has different ideas (much like on a set) and someone, indietalk presumably in this case, has to make the final decision. I think I've argued my point enough, so I'll just leave it at that.

Another factor to this single script that hasn't been mentioned yet, which could be part of the difficulty people are having with it is this.. I don't believe the single script would necessarily dictate what kind of film it would be. For example, there are many ways in which to interpret a scene written in a script... Consider a breakfast scene. A woman makes eggs and toast to serve her family. This could be a run of the mill nothing special scene out of a drama, could be portrayed as a comedy, could be done as action. It's all in the interpretation of the words on the page. I suppose the same theory would be true of a treatment, but then that brings it back to what I mentioned before, but by working from a more narrowly focused subject (the same script, versus the same 'idea') better illustrates the stylistic choices (as I said in a previous post)

Would be nice to have some kind of decision made, and stuck to.

EDIT: Jmac: personally I'm not thrilled about a comedy either, but no one would be forcing us to use these on a reel.. ;)

I'm starting to lean toward my treatment idea. Screenwriters submit a treatment, the best one for this project is chosen, filmmakers write their screenplays (or have a screenwriter on their team) based on the treatment, and produce it.

I might be able to live with that...I too, like Spatula prefer to write towards what's at hand with a low budget, and more to what I know, rather than what I don't know, or worse, don't remember anymore!

I still like the idea of being able to link all the entries together. I think that too much of the same thing will put the judges to sleep, let alone the vast Indietalk audience.

Chris

Would be nice to have some kind of decision made, and stuck to.
It's a brainstorming thread, the decision though, will be made tomorrow, and then we can figure out the rest.

Having judged two previous ITOOFC's, it was difficult to be "fair" because there were some that were good, some that were.. ok, and some that were just painful to watch.

Hey, I resemble that remark, and I agreed to pay for your new glasses, and a bottle of Tylenol anyway!

Chris

Hey, I resemble that remark, and I agreed to pay for your new glasses, and a bottle of Tylenol anyway!

Chris

My point, Chris, is that it wouldn't be "too much of the same thing" putting the judges to sleep as you put it in your previous post. It would be the element that puts them all into the same ballpark (same sport in some cases.. :lol:)

Anyone can do comedy on a zero budget (RE: Annoying Brian, I'm still laughing at this one).

Just caught that. Thanks, Rob!

I'll go with whatever, but I favor the treatment. That was a double entendre.

I'd like to hear what FilmJumper thinks of the treatment idea.

A final draft.

lol at me.
------

Anyway, I like this idea- you get a chance to write a script and then film a movie, even if they aren't the same thing. But there's the excitement of the writing comp, so cool. I'd really stress that I'd like to see some flexibility for the director to affect the ending of the script somehow- something to add our own individual signatures. It'd be like seeing the same film, only with multiple endings.

Unfortunately, I don't think that would work very well assuming we can come up with a good script from the competition. Taking an existing story and simply changing the ending could do more harm than good in the overall scheme of things but I see your point.

Having said that... Take a look at REMAKES. They NEVER have the same filmmaker's signature. In fact, take PSYCHO which was supposedly recreated shot by shot... Nothing like Hitch's. Not even close.

I SERIOUSLY doubt that we would see cookiecutter films from the same script. Every filmmaker is going to have his or her own take on the script... Different angles, lighting, etc.

filmy

Not to be a party pooper, but I would rather see the script before committing to the contest.

-Jim

I definitely think we should POST the winning script on it's own thread so ANYONE can read it and decide whether or not they're IN.

filmy

I know, I know.. but I've not been very intent on shooting other people's scripts, because I write to suit the resources I have (ultra low budget). So if it's going to be simply a contest of tech specs, I'd loose- but having an edge on creative design (aka the script) would level the playing field. But I digress, and will start the mud slinging (where's Zensteve?) here and now: I'll beat everybody even if my film is just a shot of a toilet with dubbed lines over. Huzah! Here's to me!

I think budget should be one of the judging criteria... Just like regular coverage on a script.

filmy

I don't really see what is so bad about using a single script.. it's an idea that was presented last year, if not even longer ago.. clearly there are a number of people interested in it. I think people are having difficulty getting their heads around the concept enough to realize that it's not like they are giving up any kind of control. It levels the playing field in a manner to better allow judging of film making talent (SEPARATE from screen writing talent).

Having judged two previous ITOOFC's, it was difficult to be "fair" because there were some that were good, some that were.. ok, and some that were just painful to watch. By focusing on the production element (directoral skill, shot composition, etc) and using a single screenplay makes it more likely that the submissions will at least be watchable. There won't be some with good stories, and some without.

Even saying that someone can have a screenwriter on their team is no good, because some may choose not to, thinking they're better than they are, some may work with a screenwriter who isn't that great, etc.

What happened to the idea of screenwriters submitting scripts, which would be judged, and then having the winning script be the one used for this? I know I've seen other people in support of this, in this thread and elsewhere in the past... I know I'm not alone here, but if I am, fine I'll just go off and not worry about it, however, I'm positive that I've seen posts from both the "Filmmaking Guru" and "Screenwriting Guru" in support of the single script.. among others.

I don't presume to have any authority here. Seniority doesn't matter, because there are many people who have been here longer than I, and many who have been here for a shorter time. Obviously everyone has different ideas (much like on a set) and someone, indietalk presumably in this case, has to make the final decision. I think I've argued my point enough, so I'll just leave it at that.

Another factor to this single script that hasn't been mentioned yet, which could be part of the difficulty people are having with it is this.. I don't believe the single script would necessarily dictate what kind of film it would be. For example, there are many ways in which to interpret a scene written in a script... Consider a breakfast scene. A woman makes eggs and toast to serve her family. This could be a run of the mill nothing special scene out of a drama, could be portrayed as a comedy, could be done as action. It's all in the interpretation of the words on the page. I suppose the same theory would be true of a treatment, but then that brings it back to what I mentioned before, but by working from a more narrowly focused subject (the same script, versus the same 'idea') better illustrates the stylistic choices (as I said in a previous post)

Would be nice to have some kind of decision made, and stuck to.

EDIT: Jmac: personally I'm not thrilled about a comedy either, but no one would be forcing us to use these on a reel.. ;)

Gotta go with Will on this one... However, I also understand that some might not want to make a comedy, thriller, horror, etc.

To be honest, I would rather read a myriad of screenplays... Any genre. Then pick the best of the bunch. When we finally decide on everything, I will be HAPPY to provide a list of judging criteria so that everyone knows HOW their script will be judged.

Again... Just some thoughts here.

filmy

I might be able to live with that...I too, like Spatula prefer to write towards what's at hand with a low budget, and more to what I know, rather than what I don't know, or worse, don't remember anymore!

I still like the idea of being able to link all the entries together. I think that too much of the same thing will put the judges to sleep, let alone the vast Indietalk audience.

Chris

Whether I was a judge or not, I personally would LOVE to see everyone's interpretation of the same script. That wouldn't bore me at all.

filmy

I'd like to hear what FilmJumper thinks of the treatment idea.

To be honest, I don't like the treatment idea because I'm wondering if a great treatment could IN TURN become a great script.

I know several people here that do not write treatments but can, without a doubt, write a pretty decent short screenplay... Why? Because that's what they DO! LOL.

Treatments are not scripts and not a lot of people write them. So my take on it is that you would be asking someone not able to write a treatment to go ahead and write one when they could probably write a hell of a lot better screenplay.

The two no longer go hand in hand like they did 20 years ago... Most of the professional screenwriters I know don't even write treatments. In fact, when I'm asked for a treatment I fucking send them the first 10 pages of my screenplay... LOL.

Just my take... Will be happy to go with whatever we end up with...

filmy

Some indie filmmakers like to shoot what they write, and not shoot already written scripts. That's why I like the treatment idea.

In that case wouldn't what you said to Ladd yesterday apply? If they don't like it, they don't have to participate.. :) Also, nobody is saying they can't enter something into the writing portion of it, right? So why couldn't someone do both. If their writing is good enough, they should win that part, and then they can shoot what they wrote.

Ok, maybe I'm just being devils advocate here now.. ;)

Some indie filmmakers like to shoot what they write, and not shoot already written scripts. That's why I like the treatment idea.

I hear ya... And I don't have a problem with it going that way but then, why have a treatment competition? Why not just make a list of story elements and let it go at that? Then everyone can make any kind of story they want... Comedy, Thriller, Horror... Whatever.

We still essentially end up with the same thing and then each filmmaker gets to write their own thing... We also cut out the judging of the treatments... Then we can focus on a short script challenge a few months after this short film challenge...

But I'm cool with whatever... LOL.

I just drove 7 hours and need to BEER MYSELF.

filmy

Well so far I think the one script idea is the most popular. Yes, Will, the screenwriter of the winning script could also compete in the filmmaking portion. I hope there are more opinions, I'd like to get this part done.

hehe.. seems to me that the delay is too many opinions, rather than not enough. ;)

That's okay. I have a meeting with filmy tomorrow to get it all worked out.

Cool. I look forward to hearing the outcome of the meeting. :)

What I'm seeing here is the prime example why creativity should not be a group effort. Each person has a very different view of what they want to to do.

Fo me doing what you want is not much of a challenge. The challenge is to do something we are uncomfortable doing.

Some indie filmmakers like to shoot what they write, and not shoot already written scripts.Either way, us adventurous types like a challenge. :)

Well so far I think the one script idea is the most popular. Yes, Will, the screenwriter of the winning script could also compete in the filmmaking portion. I hope there are more opinions, I'd like to get this part done.

I'm now actually kind of leaning towards the one script idea anyway- It'd be nice to see a bunch of people do MY winning screenplay.. :evil: (seriously- where has all the mayhem and mudslinging gone?)

But seriously- I'm game for whatever- I just want to make a movie!

What I'm seeing here is the prime example why creativity should not be a group effort. Each person has a very different view of what they want to to do.

Creativity is either a slow moving democracy, or a self-fufilling dictatorship. I'd tend to think the slowing down process would produce better results in the end.

Fo me doing what you want is not much of a challenge. The challenge is to do something we are uncomfortable doing.

Like Grandma.

Like Grandma.

Yikes! Damn you. I spit coffee all over my keyboard.

I could very well be that many creative people with different views could slowly work their way into an agreement that will make them all happy. I've never seen it happen, but I admit it's possible. I look forward to the final decision on the challenge.

EDIT: Jmac: personally I'm not thrilled about a comedy either, but no one would be forcing us to use these on a reel.. ;)

How right you are, Will! I'm open to whatever, as I need an excuse to practice directing actors before my next feature.

However, for good reason I'm naturally cautious when it comes to others writing the script... Like I said, though, I'm down for the contest regardless.

Cheers!

Jim

It's for this reason (that everyone wants to do something different) that the Indietalk Movie thread died a quiet death. :(

Perhaps such openness is thwarting ITOOFC 5. Okay, Indie. What's your answer?

i don't mean to be rude, but will winners actually GET their prizes this time....

i don't mean to be rude, but will winners actually GET their prizes this time....
Absolutely! Last time, I know Zensteve (a member) said he would award some books or something, I had no control over that, but the memberships WERE awarded. PM me if you didn't get the other prize and I'll make it up to you with an extended membership.

This time around it is going to be more professional.

Okay. Pretty much everything has been finalized. A dedicated page will be made for this competition and the rules and regulations will be posted on it. This page should be up by next week. Thanks for the suggestions.

This time around it is going to be more professional.

Not if I can help it! :D (I know he's talking about something else, I just wanted to use an exclaimation point, a grinning smiley, and then follow that up with an anti-climatic explaination in a long sentance contained within parenthesis).

I could very well be that many creative people with different views could slowly work their way into an agreement that will make them all happy. I've never seen it happen, but I admit it's possible. I look forward to the final decision on the challenge.

Funny enough, and true. Indietalk will make the choice (or did), and I'll go with whatever our captain decides, and it'll be great. I just know that when someone opens the floor for suggestions, you have to dive in to be part of the creative process. It's how I weaseled myself from 2nd AD to 1st AD on a shoot. The director had explained his intent well enough that he could stand back and promote everybody. I've seen it work- total strangers all coming together like a family in that moment, and filming a young boy in a swimming pool.


This page should be up by next week.

Sweet.

:clap:

Not if I can help it! :D (I know he's talking about something else, I just wanted to use an exclaimation point, a grinning smiley, and then follow that up with an anti-climatic explaination in a long sentance contained within parenthesis).



Funny enough, and true. Indietalk will make the choice (or did), and I'll go with whatever our captain decides, and it'll be great. I just know that when someone opens the floor for suggestions, you have to dive in to be part of the creative process. It's how I weaseled myself from 2nd AD to 1st AD on a shoot. The director had explained his intent well enough that he could stand back and promote everybody. I've seen it work- total strangers all coming together like a family in that moment, and filming a young boy in a swimming pool.



Sweet.

Dude... You never cease to KILL ME. LOL.

filmy

(I know he's talking about something else, I just wanted to use an exclaimation point, a grinning smiley, and then follow that up with an anti-climatic explaination in a long sentance contained within parenthesis).

Are you making fun of my standard posts? (not that my posts need any explaining or contain information that needs expounding (explanation)). ;)

Are you making fun of my standard posts? (not that my posts need any explaining or contain information that needs expounding (explanation)). ;)
Funny.. I thought he was making fun of my typical posts. I know I have a habit of going crazy with parentheticals too..

Funny.. I thought he was making fun of my typical posts. I know I have a habit of going crazy with parentheticals too..

LOL- funny enough I was making fun of myself! I think I might have hit a vein of common ground between indie filmmakers (We always add the parenthical explaination). Perhaps it's the tiny thoughts in our heads that right after calling "action" want to throw in a last minute clarification.

LOL- funny enough I was making fun of myself! I think I might have hit a vein of common ground between indie filmmakers (We always add the parenthical explaination). Perhaps it's the tiny thoughts in our heads that right after calling "action" want to throw in a last minute clarification.

Oh.. no. That's clearly just you. ;) :lol:

The scheduled launch date of "IndieTalk's Script to Screen Challenge" is Nov. 10th, with a dedicated area on the website with all the info. Great sponsors and prizes lined up. You are in for a surprise! I'll give one little hint, in case you want to get a head start. There is a screenwriting competition, 10 pages or less, any genre. That's all I'm saying! :)

There is a screenwriting competition, 10 pages or less, any genre.

FADE IN:

LOC disqualified...no camera directions ;)

Doh!

:lol:

http://www.indietalk.com/showthread.php?t=10485
New thread.